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Post by ketmar on Sept 11, 2024 23:50:03 GMT -5
don't worry: ten years in the future personal computers would be rare beasts anyway. so enjoy while you still can. ;-)
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40oz
diRTbAg
Posts: 6,105
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Post by 40oz on Sept 12, 2024 7:37:39 GMT -5
'short-termism', not 'capitalism'. What is your sensitivity to this word? The suffix 'ism' is used to create nouns that describe a set of actions, conditions, or beliefs. Businesses believe there's a necessity for their creations to exist for a short duration for reasons that are separate from the pursuit of capital? I don't see any source port programmers thinking with this approach at all in the entire time I've been here. At least until their interest, motivation, or other material conditions prevent them from maintaining it. Walk me through this belief.
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Post by camper on Sept 12, 2024 9:18:38 GMT -5
I warn you in advance! If I accidentally use English suffixes, it's Google Translate that's mixed everything up. I don't understand anything about them myself.
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Post by gije on Sept 12, 2024 13:06:06 GMT -5
'short-termism', not 'capitalism'. What is your sensitivity to this word? The suffix 'ism' is used to create nouns that describe a set of actions, conditions, or beliefs. Businesses believe there's a necessity for their creations to exist for a short duration for reasons that are separate from the pursuit of capital? I don't see any source port programmers thinking with this approach at all in the entire time I've been here. At least until their interest, motivation, or other material conditions prevent them from maintaining it. Walk me through this belief. While I'm not the one being addressed here, I want to point out that 'capitalism' is a thought-terminating cliche created by the marxists themselves to strawman private enterprise. You say 'businesses believe', but you're referring to the behavior of publicly-traded corporations influenced by ridiculous economic policies encouraged by marxists over the last century or so with the aim of causing the collapse of 'capitalism'. A privately-held company can be run by a proprietor with any given number of beliefs and motives, whereas a publicly-traded one is subject to the stupidity and malice of random shareholders and a greater number of corrupt arms of centralized power. (It was the business part-owner John Carmack who pushed to open the source to begin with.. of course, id was a private company back then and up until they sold to Bethesda/Zenimax) Edit: Might have gone off a bit half-cocked and past the actual context. That said, the meme of publicly-traded corps (in reality, their human (arguable..) investors) seeking only profit is very easily dismissed, these days (Sony, Disney, Ubisoft, etc for the lowest-hanging fruit.) This meme is based on the concept of rational actors seeking redress for companies pursuing unprofitable ends through trade authorities, but if the investors (the ones with standing) are instead forcing the company to destroy itself, then the meme falls apart.
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Post by trustanus on Sept 12, 2024 13:35:07 GMT -5
Gay convo
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Post by gije on Sept 12, 2024 13:36:08 GMT -5
Agreed, but it gets so damned tiresome seeing retarded retreads of the same angle of it. I don't intend on continuing it; just wanted to plant seeds.
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nnn✓ork
Doomer
Dr. Noisystein
Posts: 719
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Post by nnn✓ork on Sept 12, 2024 16:50:02 GMT -5
I want to point out that 'capitalism' is a thought-terminating cliche created by the marxists themselves to strawman private enterprise. Pretty much this. Do I whip out Scrooge McPaper or Sir Incel Newton ( "gravity is keeping us down, man") for this one. The word's fine depending on how it's used. It's fine if used colloquially here and there if it's clear what is being talked about. And I must bring up dn's analysis postings on brevity vs detail, in regards to language economy and language policing. But here the word is usually used with unsubstansive, incohesive ad-hoc rhetoric from what I call the "problematic-oids". Arguments from people with the philosophical attention span of a gold fish, as they flounder around trying to explain why all configurations of things, everything and their opposite, are actually bad... and are bad because of MONEY! in particular. And if not money, move the goal-post and abstract the issue to CAPITAL, and then to POWER or whatever. Timeline A: "Beer is a capitalist conspiracy to keep the proletariat content in their poorness and just satisfied enough." Timeline B: "Prohibition is a violation of freedom! and a conspiracy to keep the working class sharp, productive but miserable." And When people complain about MONEY, if they suggest an alternative at all, at best they suggest that to hold the rich accountable, we need to obscure the accounting system (MONEY) in various ways.
Tldr; I don't hate the word 'capitalism', it's just often a meme word that people label things as to cop out of actually thinking critically. And everything is just a different configuration of capitalism anyways, the good, bad and ugly. Maybe this is separate strain of thought, but here's a funny example of two companies people hate, though one is not like the other. -Nintendo: Doting helicopter mother, overprotective of her children. Attacks everyone unconditionally who interacts with their brands. Annoying, yes, but at least there's some partial virtue in it, I guess... -Bobby Kotick (former Activision/Blizzard CEO): Sacrifices his adopted kids to Moloch to cheese out quarterly profit and line his pockets. Only to take his bag and dip from the company after selling off to Microsoft... And I argue that this was against Activision/Blizzard's long-term interests wrt its franchises. (pretty sure Kotick must have had a Nixon/Epstein style black-book on his board members. he sucked ass). The word, Short-termism, cuts to the point better, imo. Being unethical in the short-term often costs the long-term. But at the end of the day, there's people who complain that they have to spend money for OverWatch 2 skins, and simply state "capitalism" as the source of their woes... They aren't better than any CEOs, are they. This is why we can't have nice things.
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40oz
diRTbAg
Posts: 6,105
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Post by 40oz on Sept 13, 2024 13:13:22 GMT -5
It's disappointing to hear that having known each other for this long, that by my usage of the word 'capitalism' i'm reduced to a inattentive troll that can't think critically. Like I didn't cultivate this community or map with you across dozens of community projects or that you haven't read hundreds, maybe thousands of my posts on this forum across many years.
It just sucks.
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Post by ketmar on Sept 13, 2024 13:49:57 GMT -5
sorry. it was hard to resist.
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SilverMiner
You're trying to say you like DOS better than me, right?
Posts: 1,342
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Post by SilverMiner on Sept 14, 2024 10:48:35 GMT -5
Marxism is okay, but is not enough. Cuz it doesn't take in account people's unconscious. It's more freud kind of thing
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Post by ketmar on Sept 14, 2024 11:36:48 GMT -5
i keep wondering how come that all around know everything about "marxism", and only i, being a comminust, don't even know what the fuck it is.
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StodgyAyatollah
Doomer
I'm not here. You're just imagining things.
Posts: 504
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Post by StodgyAyatollah on Sept 14, 2024 15:29:17 GMT -5
i keep wondering how come that all around know everything about "marxism", and only i, being a comminust, don't even know what the fuck it is. Are you familiar with the Frankfurt School? If you're somewhat familiar with that and trends in the US, both culturally and in academia it's pretty obvious why Marxism has become a buzzword in the west. If you're not familiar you may want to look into it to see where other branches of your philosophy are currently at.
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Post by trustanus on Sept 14, 2024 15:41:35 GMT -5
Cockism
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Post by deathevokation on Sept 14, 2024 16:32:54 GMT -5
It's disappointing to hear that having known each other for this long, that by my usage of the word 'capitalism' i'm reduced to a inattentive troll that can't think critically. Like I didn't cultivate this community or map with you across dozens of community projects or that you haven't read hundreds, maybe thousands of my posts on this forum across many years. It just sucks. To be honest, politics isn't something that can be casually discussed with Americans.. families get torn apart over political discussions, children turn their fathers in to the police (over the Jan 6th incident).. people will hate every bone in your body and would celebrate your death if they think you're on the "wrong side" or because you don't take it "seriously" enough, it's toxic as fuck and the discourse surrounding it is why we're in such a dark place atm.
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Post by ketmar on Sept 15, 2024 1:43:52 GMT -5
Are you familiar with the Frankfurt School? that's the cadaver which has nothing to do with what Marx did. and there is no such thing as "marxism" at all. Marx invented marxist dialectics (by sanitizing hegelian dialectic), and then demonstrated the application of his method in "Das Kapital". that's it. there is nothing more than a scientific method, which could be applied to any field of study. "Das Kapital" is NOT "the marxism book" in the sense of "explaining the world". it is just a technical demo of dialectic method.
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StodgyAyatollah
Doomer
I'm not here. You're just imagining things.
Posts: 504
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Post by StodgyAyatollah on Sept 15, 2024 5:15:43 GMT -5
that's the cadaver which has nothing to do with what Marx did. Cadaver? I live in a nation whose very existence has been threatened by the prevalence of the plague that is critical theory and you audaciously call it a cadaver.. and there is no such thing as "marxism" at all. Marx invented marxist dialectics (by sanitizing hegelian dialectic), and then demonstrated the application of his method in "Das Kapital". that's it. there is nothing more than a scientific method, which could be applied to any field of study. "Das Kapital" is NOT "the marxism book" in the sense of "explaining the world". it is just a technical demo of dialectic method. Marx presented a worldview using Hegel's framework. That worldview being what we colloquially have referred to as Marxism for many decades now. I know you don't want to be associated with the unwanted stepchildren but they are part of your philosophies family. I'm not going to stop properly using a word because it's a "buzzword" or people getting butthurt and neither should anyone else. Shit's Marxist.
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Post by trustanus on Sept 15, 2024 7:04:13 GMT -5
So everyone in doom community is either a trans commie or an autist commie? Got it.
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nnn✓ork
Doomer
Dr. Noisystein
Posts: 719
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Post by nnn✓ork on Sept 15, 2024 9:10:36 GMT -5
i keep wondering how come that all around know everything about "marxism", and only i, being a comminust, don't even know what the fuck it is. Heheheh. I think I agree. Imo goth girls should rule the planet. Capitalism, Communism, fuck those guys. I want Goth-girlism. In noisyvelvet's America, you will worship goth girls and be happy, or else.
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Post by ketmar on Sept 15, 2024 13:21:55 GMT -5
that's the cadaver which has nothing to do with what Marx did. Cadaver? I live in a nation whose very existence has been threatened by the prevalence of the plague that is critical theory and you audaciously call it a cadaver.. ancient theory of flat Earth led to scientific and social improvements too. it still doesn't mean that Earth is flat. but we can ignore real Earth form for many calculations, so it is "imaginary flat". most cadavers has something usable, even if it is not right. still, it has nothing to do with Marx. it is essentialy "anti-marxist" (if we well use the word "marxism" as "the basics of Marx's method"). Marx presented a worldview using Hegel's framework. heavily modified. so heavily, that it is basically a completely different language. the modification itself is quite minor (roughly speaking, removing idealism from dialectic), but the consequences are gross. ;-) That worldview being what we colloquially have referred to as Marxism for many decades now. I know you don't want to be associated with the unwanted stepchildren but they are part of your philosophies family. as much as flat Earth is the part of science. as it has no meaning, any using of it will be proper. and meaningless.
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Post by ketmar on Sept 15, 2024 13:31:17 GMT -5
Imo goth girls should rule the planet. Capitalism, Communism, fuck those guys. I want Goth-girlism. In noisyvelvet's America, you will worship goth girls and be happy, or else. where should i send my citizenship application?!
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StodgyAyatollah
Doomer
I'm not here. You're just imagining things.
Posts: 504
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Post by StodgyAyatollah on Sept 15, 2024 14:48:11 GMT -5
ancient theory of flat Earth led to scientific and social improvements too. it still doesn't mean that Earth is flat. but we can ignore real Earth form for many calculations, so it is "imaginary flat". most cadavers has something usable, even if it is not right. still, it has nothing to do with Marx. it is essentialy "anti-marxist" (if we well use the word "marxism" as "the basics of Marx's method"). It's modeled after and inspired by Marx's work and in their eyes is it's logical progression. "Filling in for his blind spots" as the argument goes. And unlike flat earthers it's a rampant ideology here in the states. I do think he would be quite unhappy with it and we could debate it's merit in relation to his work but it's a functional descriptive term that has a meaning as I had linked. There are plenty of words that don't represent what they are used to describe with full accuracy but such is language and I have no interest in debating those semantics. If you want to argue that they hijacked his name I wouldn't necessarily disagree but don't consider that important. To me it's like someone arguing that there's no such thing as a soulslike genre in games after a game is called that because it's aping Dark Souls mechanics, despite clearly not being Dark Souls. Shit's still a soulslike.
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Post by deathevokation on Sept 15, 2024 16:42:01 GMT -5
So everyone in doom community is either a trans commie or an autist commie? Got it. I'm just an autist.
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Post by ketmar on Sept 15, 2024 17:12:03 GMT -5
If you want to argue that they hijacked his name I wouldn't necessarily disagree but don't consider that important. yet i do. we cannot have good things if we are using wrong words. it's like if i would rename k8vavoom to Doom: it is technically still Doom, right? so it would be a logical move. and if i'll be able to get away with it (let's pretend i will ;-), then all other idTech1 forks should be compared to my engine, because my engine would become "The Real Doom" in the eyes of most people. because 'cmon, i simply "filled the blind spots", so k8vavoom is The Doom now! that's why i am so sensitive to this topic.
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StodgyAyatollah
Doomer
I'm not here. You're just imagining things.
Posts: 504
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Post by StodgyAyatollah on Sept 15, 2024 21:43:20 GMT -5
that's why i am so sensitive to this topic. And I thought it was because you were a commie.
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Post by ketmar on Sept 15, 2024 22:01:05 GMT -5
i am against using ANY wrong terms. the level of sensitivity is different for different ones, though. ;-)
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