40oz
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Posts: 6,105
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Post by 40oz on May 18, 2024 8:26:22 GMT -5
I had kind of a fleeting thought recently. Wanted to run it by some people but I'll just post it here.
Context:
So, originally, I added 'Dumbworld' (previously 'losers') as a place to shove locked threads and have a 'time-out' place to put members that are posting stuff that is just shy of warranting a ban. Morally, I find this practice kinda cruel so I almost never use it.
On the other hand, I had some unfortunate life events which kinda led me to blink out of existence from the doom community for a while. I didn't really want to do this, but a large portion of the active people in this community often say things that don't really inspire any hope for the future. While my life is generally pretty stable, I can tolerate a fair distribution of shitty things to read. In fact, I realized that I was often supplementing this with my own threads about topics I was interested in and then when I left this forum to its own devices, I was completely uninterested in pretty much all of it.
I have to consider that there are people who have lives that tend lean more towards the unstable experience I'm just recently rising out of. And while that is happening, Doomer Boards forum is a wildly unpleasant place to seek. I feel some type of way about administrating a forum that I don't actually enjoy participating in.
Fundamentally, I don't enjoy banning people, because I know Doom is a niche interest, and if one doesn't fit in at doomworld, it's not like their interest in Doom goes away. It's very lonely life liking something as rich with content like Doom and not having anyone to talk to about it. Especially because doomworld bans people on "behavior," often reflecting community standards of other social media platforms; If you're not succeeding on these niche forums, you're probably not doing well anywhere else too. Having seen a small window of the mental health of some participants on this forum through their writing over the course of my time here, it feels almost hostile to put someone like that in a position of total isolation through a forum ban.
I'm still recovering from dreadful feelings of "what's the point" so I need baby steps as I move forward to not flip my desk over and get stuck in a decision paralysis again. I'm trying to figure out a way that I can learn to like this place again, so that I wouldn't need to vanish when shit gets rough. Many of us have known each other for a very very long time. It would be nice to be able to lean on the people on this forum to be loving and respectful when times are tough for each other. Four months ago, to now, I don't feel like there's been any steps closer in that direction without my intervention.
Proposal:
I've been thinking a little bit about doing a trial run where I simply halve the population of the Doomer Boards community using my own discretion -- no official rules. I would brazenly shove them into Dumbworld so I can test what Doomer Boards could be. But not without first adding some furniture.
Dumbworld is currently just one subforum with a bunch of locked threads, but perhaps it could be populated with subforums that this forum's unhealthily angry people use Doomer Boards for. That way Dumbworld could be a sanctuary, a habitat if you will, for people that need to interrupt any otherwise fun and inviting conversations to post these kinds of things. And because there's enough people like that here, they could all congregate there instead pulverizing the reading experience of the general audiences elsewhere that might otherwise find interesting Doom content on Doomer Boards. Or better, have aspirations to join this forum and make friends and not feel like their identity might inhibit them from doing so.
As a non-dumbworld member, you'd still get to read what goes on there if you so desire, but perhaps not without some kind of a trigger warning in place first.
So far one of the things holding me back is it will require a lot of manual and emotional labor from me that I still yet don't feel equipped to do. So ummm.. anyone wanna volunteer themselves to:
- point out people that you think belong in this 'new dumbworld'
- refer to posts that really sucked to read
- would be open to having the moderating power to move people and posts to dumbworld
- would like to nominate someone to have such moderating power
you can either post it here or send me a private message if you don't feel comfortable outing yourself here.
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40oz
diRTbAg
Posts: 6,105
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Post by 40oz on May 18, 2024 8:36:48 GMT -5
One thing I forgot to add is that if it's decided this should move forward for now on, dumbworld should also have some kinda path to redemption or appeal process so people who end up in there don't have be stuck there permanently.
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xeepeep
Banned
Forever
Posts: 2,338 
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Post by xeepeep on May 18, 2024 9:01:03 GMT -5
I disagree with the idea of molding the forum to fit what YOU PERSONALLY like better. DB is its own community not your fan club, we're not here because of you (well I suppose some are), you don't need to be anyone's life coach.
If you don't like Doomer boards and being its administrator is a chore to you, just step away and give it to someone else, just like it was given to you, what, seven years ago.
What you could do is just ban schizoposters and retards who contribute absolutely nothing and whom no one likes. Examples: all russian users that aren't Ketmar and Silverminer, werner goldberg and his anal buddy who writes in riddles, maybe that weird Slavic guy who writes teasers for posts about his (content removed), doomworld tr@nnies like Segfault who hate this forum but are still active for some reason etc etc etc.
This measure would make the forum much more enjoyable at no cost whatsoever.
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skyr
Doomer
pocket full of rocket fuel and pyramid stones
Posts: 264
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Post by skyr on May 18, 2024 10:32:30 GMT -5
Four months ago, to now, I don't feel like there's been any steps closer in that direction without my intervention. Maybe I missed something because I wasnt really active the last 4 months, just checked the site sporadically, but other than tainted slav coming back, immediatly started schizo posting and then got banned for a few days by dn, did anything big/controversial happen in the mean time? As far as I saw it the forum held up pretty okay. the dbp crew released two project and already started with the third. And the rest of the forum just did their usual socially inept attempt of interacting with eachother, seemingly without too much fighting and hate spewing. But again maybe I missed something. I wouldnt be against banning the schizoposters, but other than tainted slav, whose presence is just uninteresting uninspired vile hatred, I dont know who should be banned or put in dumbworld. I have no issues with werner and the riddler, I assume xeep is talking about himself when he says the weird slavic guy and I dont even think segfault is even active anymore. And other than that I cant think of anyone else who could qualify. So I think its a bit too much to do all this, because I dont reasons to put people in dumbworld |
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skyr
Doomer
pocket full of rocket fuel and pyramid stones
Posts: 264
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Post by skyr on May 18, 2024 10:35:25 GMT -5
having said that putting people in dumbworld would be funny so fuck it, go for it
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2024 10:49:02 GMT -5
so far you might've been the only one other than 40 to openly voice any sort of grievance, funny considering i never gave you any shit about your own artistic shitposting. either way seems like this would only start some drama for no good reason (i don't have any issue with da tainted slav either). i wasn't posting too often either way and this forum isn't active enough to resume banning people, if you further the overall gentrification in the community i might be out on principle pretty much (not that anyone cares ofc, much less myself... gaymin can be rather antisocial, but at least my name isn't steve) |
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40oz
diRTbAg
Posts: 6,105
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Post by 40oz on May 18, 2024 11:04:40 GMT -5
I disagree with the idea of molding the forum to fit what YOU PERSONALLY like better. DB is its own community not your fan club, we're not here because of you (well I suppose some are), you don't need to be anyone's life coach. Suppose I just mirrored doomer boards exactly. Dumbworld would have a doom general, a doom projects, a thy flesh consumed, music, etc. A forum just like this, but with me gone. Essentially you'd have the same forum, you can have your schizos and extremists that get put in there along with an open door for anyone that requests to go in there, and you'd be left to foster that community at your own discretion, free from the socialist utopia it sounds like you think i am trying to create. Wouldn't you just get that if I left anyway? What difference does it make if there's two places? |
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CittyKat112
Doomer
Kitty cat one hundred and twelve
Posts: 804
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Post by CittyKat112 on May 18, 2024 11:48:00 GMT -5
I'd say go for it, even though it probably won't affect the reputation this forum has in any way. Honestly this place sucked when you were gone and maybe having one place for shitposting and another for honest and respectful discussions without shit flinging and constant whining about state of the (Doom)world will at least help with attracting more people not to just join DBPs but also engage with the forum in other ways because when you've been here long enough you'll realize just how miserable and suffocating this place is. Every time you try to take a look at non-DBP threads, you'll be met with hostility, people constantly bitching about stupid shit and BS drama so in the end any possibility of having an interesting discussion gets drown out never to be seen again.
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40oz
diRTbAg
Posts: 6,105
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Post by 40oz on May 18, 2024 13:14:41 GMT -5
I'd say go for it, even though it probably won't affect the reputation this forum has in any way. Honestly this place sucked when you were gone and maybe having one place for shitposting and another for honest and respectful discussions without shit flinging and constant whining about state of the (Doom)world will at least help with attracting more people not to just join DBPs but also engage with the forum in other ways because when you've been here long enough you'll realize just how miserable and suffocating this place is. Every time you try to take a look at non-DBP threads, you'll be met with hostility, people constantly bitching about stupid shit and BS drama so in the end any possibility of having an interesting discussion gets drown out never to be seen again. Man that was hard to read. I don't have that exact experience, but I do know that trying to steer any kinda thread that veers off course back to the original intent is hard as fuck sometimes. If its hard for me, I can't imagine its a piece of cake for anyone else. Like I won't just post a thread sometimes, ill first write it on a notepad in an app on my phone for a few days or a week and then re-read it a bunch of times when im in different moods to check if someone might feel like getting pissed about it and talking about something entirely different than the subject I started with. Its weird to say that out loud, but like what kinda free-speech transparency platform do you have if you have to fuckin filter yourself all the time because someone might call you names over it or some shit? It stops being fun to play here. I don't really get pissed at anyone for not being funny when they're trying. I get kinda sick of reading messages that makes any people on the other end of their devices' screens feel bad, or in even a slightly worse mood than they're already in even. Especially when it's not even me they're directing the messages at. It doesn't get to double as comedy that's worth standing by or fighting to preserve in any way. It just sucks sometimes. I'd like to do this as an experiment, honestly, just to hold the two places side by side -- one forum where moderation has some kind of a strictness to it so you don't have to worry about your thread becoming a dumpster fire. And then another place where you can literally do whatever you want and to just to see what happens. At that point there might be some clear data about what people actually go to doomer boards for. |
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xeepeep
Banned
Forever
Posts: 2,338
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Post by xeepeep on May 18, 2024 13:20:24 GMT -5
Suppose I just mirrored doomer boards exactly. (etc.) What's your selling point then? "you'd have the same forum" I ALREADY have the same forum. I have a banana and you're offering me to take my banana and give me another banana that's exactly the same in every way. What's the point of that. By fracturing the forum in two you'd just introduce more division for no reason. Amusing retardposters wouldn't be allowed in your PG-13 socialist paradise, but they also wouldn't hang out in the underground sewer town with Tainted slav and werner goldberg because sewers stink. |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on May 18, 2024 13:35:28 GMT -5
if anything it's funny to tell people to point fingers at anyone "problematic" and then pretend to be interested in any sort of honest conversation. anyone other than xeep can come out, call me a cunt or a retard and i would hardly bat an eye, it would probably explain some things in fact -- that's honest conversation to me, everything else i'm not interested in to put it mildly. i know i would sooner delete my account rather than beg for forgiveness behind bars. still dunno what i ever did to the serbtard, but whatever
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CittyKat112
Doomer
Kitty cat one hundred and twelve
Posts: 804
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Post by CittyKat112 on May 18, 2024 13:46:03 GMT -5
if anything it's funny to tell people to point fingers at anyone "problematic" and then pretend to be interested in any sort of honest conversation. anyone other than xeep can come out, call me a cunt or a retard and i would hardly bat an eye, it would probably explain some things in fact -- that's honest conversation to me, everything else i'm not interested in to put it mildly. i know i would sooner delete my account rather than beg for forgiveness behind bars. still dunno what i ever did to the serbtard, but whatever I think 40 just wants to see if having a reservation for retards like us will make the forum more attractive for normies who just want to play some Dewm and talk about some random innocent stuff without bringing up cringey soyjak memes or jokes about holocaust and transphobia. Also I think you're pretty chill, I don't think anyone could have any problems with you except for that weird GreatScythe guy. |
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40oz
diRTbAg
Posts: 6,105
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Post by 40oz on May 18, 2024 14:07:02 GMT -5
Suppose I just mirrored doomer boards exactly. (etc.) What's your selling point then? "you'd have the same forum" I ALREADY have the same forum. I have a banana and you're offering me to take my banana and give me another banana that's exactly the same in every way. What's the point of that. By fracturing the forum in two you'd just introduce more division for no reason. Amusing retardposters wouldn't be allowed in your PG-13 socialist paradise, but they also wouldn't hang out in the underground sewer town with Tainted slav and werner goldberg because sewers stink. Well.... what if you didn't? after i came back here I saw this board had two fucking warnings from proboards, and I see that there were posts that needed to be edited and two people temporary banned. So today I'm reading dn derail your thread unprompted to talk about how he had to look at an IRL friend lose his mind to DTs, and I'm supposed to come back here unmoved by the fact that dn was forced into a position where he had to do any fucking work here at all...? Consider that, literally right now, right this very second, that if i go to any page on this forum and ctrl+f for a synonym for large phallus slur, I'll get a hit on every thread you've ever participated in. Even if its about a topic people might actually enjoy like - "What's your most/least favorite techbase level that doesn't use STARTAN textures?" - "If your preferred source port became defunct and unusable, which source port would you migrate to?" - "Could you ever switch to a different controller/device away from keyboard and mouse?" - "Does stock doom 1/2 music reordered like Plutonia count as new music or do you prefer new midis every time?" - "What level design trope did you used to like but now realize kinds sucks?" Where do you think you're coming from when you use words like "we" and "us" when you're talking about what people come to doomer boards for? When you lead with the example of your entire profile on this forum putting the forum in danger of being deleted? Are you all coming here to watch your entire post history get deleted forever on a whim? What the fuck are even a little bit talking about? |
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StodgyAyatollah
Doomer
I'm not here. You're just imagining things.
Posts: 504
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Post by StodgyAyatollah on May 18, 2024 14:16:00 GMT -5
40oz I think having subforums specifically for those that want to do all the shit flinging and such and ones with higher standards could work. I think if it was implemented it should also be optional where a person interacts between them unless they lose that privilege. From my experience though this kind of splitting of things can cause a lot of underlying issues. We tried something similar at a forum I did some moderation for a lifetime ago. It ended up being pretty ugly. I can't say I'm terribly fond of the idea being a bit of a free speech absolutist either but I can empathize with your desire to try something like it. I also get the reality of this being a probards site. Having said that, a simpler answer may just be to moderate sub forums differently. Maybe restructure them a bit to accommodate/clarify which is which. I don't know what tools proboards has these days but if there is a way to allow users to perform some basic moderation on their own threads as they choose that could be another option. I generally consider major restructuring a bad idea as it always has unintended consequences, especially when you have the chaos of human involvement. Smaller things like that may be more manageable while achieving something similar to what your looking for. Just some ideas that crossed my mind.
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xeepeep
Banned
Forever
Posts: 2,338
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Post by xeepeep on May 18, 2024 14:25:28 GMT -5
Where do you think you're coming from when you use words like "we" and "us" when you're talking about what people come to doomer boards for? I never said a thing about that. I said Doomer boards existed before you were in charge and its identity is separate from you. That's a fact and anyone will confirm this. I'll change my username lol I was just waiting for someone to call me out on that. Better? |
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40oz
diRTbAg
Posts: 6,105
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Post by 40oz on May 18, 2024 14:37:45 GMT -5
Where do you think you're coming from when you use words like "we" and "us" when you're talking about what people come to doomer boards for? I never said a thing about that. At anyone's earliest convenience, Is anyone else reading the same words I am? Who is in these collectives? I disagree with the idea of molding the forum to fit what YOU PERSONALLY like better. DB is its own community not your fan club, we're not here because of you (well I suppose some are), you don't need to be anyone's life coach. If you don't like Doomer boards and being its administrator is a chore to you, just step away and give it to someone else, just like it was given to you, what, seven years ago. What you could do is just ban schizoposters and retards who contribute absolutely nothing and whom no one likes. Examples: all russian users that aren't Ketmar and Silverminer, werner goldberg and his anal buddy who writes in riddles, maybe that weird Slavic guy who writes teasers for posts about his (content removed), doomworld tr@nnies like Segfault who hate this forum but are still active for some reason etc etc etc. This measure would make the forum much more enjoyable at no cost whatsoever. |
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Post by Killer5 on May 18, 2024 14:40:43 GMT -5
This is getting dangerously close to what doomworld did in 2021. I want to know exactly what is and is not considered acceptable for regular doomerboards.
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xeepeep
Banned
Forever
Posts: 2,338
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Post by xeepeep on May 18, 2024 15:02:04 GMT -5
I'm out of words, honestly.
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Post by Killer5 on May 18, 2024 15:03:53 GMT -5
Nvmd. Not wasting another minute of my time in another conversation like this. Doom is something I should be doing for fun and wasting my time thinking about who should and should not be squelched in a community is not something that is desirable in the least.
Removing myself from the Doom community entirely is the best option. Stopping posting entirely in doomworld back in 2021 was hard but got easier after about a month. See no reason why I can't do it again.
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40oz
diRTbAg
Posts: 6,105
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Post by 40oz on May 18, 2024 15:06:58 GMT -5
This is getting dangerously close to what doomworld did in 2021. I want to know exactly what is and is not considered acceptable for regular doomerboards. See, I don't think it is very close at all. Doomworld is an independently hosted domain that someone actually makes money on for people to participate in. They started deleting posts and threads and splitting the ship in two. People that got pushed or jumped off the boat had to reach for a life preserver from a place like doomer boards to keep close to doom fans. That's not everyone's story, but it's enough. Me on the other hand, I'm just fucking consumer cattle that's LARPing as someone with power. While I was unemployed I was still paying a subscription fee to limit ads on this forum (up to a certain limit; i'd have to pay a much more ridiculous fee to remove all) and I get no return if everything that's ever been posted here gets deleted forever by proboards and everyone here first gets super pissed at me for letting this happen, and has to flee and find each other over some other communication channel. Proboards closing this forum is the equivalent of every one of us being banned all at once. Something that I might have prevented if I submitted to the popular opinion that communication channels need a little bit of cleaning from time to time. So the compromise is you follow the rules dear leader proboards assigned to us, and respect members on a more personalized level. Realize that individual people are not only their groups, and that the things you say don't have to hurt you in order for it to hurt anyone else, I'd like to emphasize a mutual effort to keep this place fun and minimize stress. So when I and people like me are having a stressful time, a Doom community can be a cool place to go when the rest of the world sucks. If people find there is more stress in one place and not the other, maybe we will have some concrete data and decide together what should be done from there. If that's a concept that you've already embraced and/or see no issue participating on this doom forum without openly resisting in front of every reader that browses this forum during the duration of a trial period, then we should be all good. |
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skyr
Doomer
pocket full of rocket fuel and pyramid stones
Posts: 264
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Post by skyr on May 18, 2024 15:08:52 GMT -5
This is getting dangerously close to what doomworld did in 2021. I want to know exactly what is and is not considered acceptable for regular doomerboards. Is it tho? I think there is a big difference between "We will ban you on this forum for what you did somewhere else" and "You'll only be allowed on a part of the forum for the shit you said on this forum" after i came back here I saw this board had two fucking warnings from proboards This is pretty important context I'd say. It doesnt matter if you're here for doom or here for the freedom of speech shitposting, no one will be able to enjoy either if there is no forum left. The amount of freedom of speech we have is completely depended on how much proboards will tolerate. So yeah I'd say go for it. And while I have no problem with sending people to dumbworld when they are being extremely hatefull, banning, for example, xeep because he talks about his dick on a post thats about your favorite imp placement would be stupid imo. Its inoffensive, at worst you'll just roll your eyes at that, at best you'll laught at it, but normally you just feel sorry for him because no one else has ever mentioned his dick and thats a sad life for a dick to have. |
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40oz
diRTbAg
Posts: 6,105
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Post by 40oz on May 18, 2024 15:14:38 GMT -5
I'm out of words, honestly. Can you be out of giant font sizes and images too? |
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nnn✓ork
Doomer
Dr. Noisystein
Posts: 719
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Post by nnn✓ork on May 18, 2024 15:39:05 GMT -5
Killer5 - Hey now, don't leave entirely. People unironically love and respect you. Also, I might have to exodus to Texa-dus soon too... maybe. It's a "blue state blues" kinda issue. I also have job offerings in California that I'm struggling to consider. Yeh, things are weird as fuck. You aren't completely alone, i guess.
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CittyKat112
Doomer
Kitty cat one hundred and twelve
Posts: 804
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Post by CittyKat112 on May 18, 2024 15:40:31 GMT -5
I'll miss you, Killer5 :'(
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nnn✓ork
Doomer
Dr. Noisystein
Posts: 719
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Post by nnn✓ork on May 18, 2024 15:43:42 GMT -5
Congrats on the job. Also, "hate" is unqualifiable. You can't blame people for feeling uneasy about such. I mean, you are too... I'm not in my best sorts right now, but personally, I think wojaks depicting people being hanged should be banned. Dumb dogs need to be put down. Limit testing is a virtue and a curse, use it wisely. Otherwise... Meh. |
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