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Post by Doomguy 2000 on Dec 10, 2017 2:16:19 GMT -5
Thought I would be the first one to create a there about this year's cacowards before someone beat me to it. www.doomworld.com/24years/The only thing that I found interesting was Void and Rainbow. Unless there's anything else from this year that you guys recommend I play, let me know. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2017 2:44:49 GMT -5
Little known that 3 hours before this cunt posted this.
(If you want to be pedantic that was a post and not a thread, but still, cunts) |
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Post by Doomguy 2000 on Dec 10, 2017 2:46:18 GMT -5
Oh, I guess you beat me to it I just didn't notice your thread.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2017 2:47:23 GMT -5
Both multiplayer WADs are nothing short of amazing. I'm talking perfect deathmatch gameplay. Sublime stuff, no exaggeration.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2017 2:51:35 GMT -5
Queue them up for the next Doomer Board multiplayer session that you will be organising in the very near future, yes?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2017 2:53:38 GMT -5
Yes, definitely!
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2017 3:27:23 GMT -5
And congrats to Graf Zahl for the following award:  Great pic Doomkid! |
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40oz
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Post by 40oz on Dec 10, 2017 9:51:41 GMT -5
Happy Birthday Doom!
Pyrrhic looks awesome.
I've already played all the cacowards I would have been interested in playing. The rest of the stuff like gameplay mods and artsy stuff is a little out of my wheelhouse.
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40oz
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Post by 40oz on Dec 10, 2017 10:32:54 GMT -5
Holy crap i didn't even see the comments section. It's weird to see so many angry posts filling up a thread responding to a known mean-post-writer when he writes a mean post.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2017 12:47:23 GMT -5
**[My opinion]** - Lutz should have won a proper Cacoward for Hellscape, not a runner-up. Give the runner-up to one of those "artsy" wads instead.
Also, Graf Zahl and I don't agree on much(and certainly not politics), but he's entitled to his opinion, and in many ways he is right. Tons of authors do cater their wads to the judges' tastes and proclivities, which are well-known by now, in hopes of making the Cacoward list. This is pretty normal human behavior - humans seek validation and praise from their peers. If you think that you'll be rewarded for doing a certain thing a certain way, you will start doing it that way much more often in order to reap the reward. In this case, it's Doom community accolades.
And Graf's post certainly wasn't tactful or diplomatic, but come on now. It's being called disgusting and abusive? When did we become such pussies that we feel abused by someone saying something was "visual garbage" or "mediocre"? Is it nice? No. But abusive? Jesus Christ, harden the fuck up Doomworld.
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40oz
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Post by 40oz on Dec 10, 2017 14:49:16 GMT -5
This is the forum you asked for, dude.  |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2017 15:10:55 GMT -5
Fuck ling when he gets all upset and throws a girly hissy fit, fucking ugly childish behaviour... speaking of morale I’m sure it doesn’t boost others’ when you flat out tell them in the nomination/mentionation thread (why dance around the words) that the peoples opinions on the wads don’t matter one iota. Sieg heil ling you modern new age nazi you.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2017 18:55:08 GMT -5
Also, Tormentor667 brought up a good point. Blade of Agony Episode 2 wasn't even mentioned in the 2017 Cacowards. Am I the only one who thinks that's fucked up? Blade of Agony is incredible.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2017 19:04:48 GMT -5
Politics yo
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40oz
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Post by 40oz on Dec 11, 2017 8:13:27 GMT -5
I don't think it's fucked up. Doom modding activity has exploded in recent years. Even though not a whole lot of it is very good, there's still a ton of pretty awesome stuff that comes out annually. If something doesn't win, that doesn't mean it wasn't good enough. The cacowards has expanded in such a way that many people look forward to it all year, so the people writing for it are in kind of a weird position to award some of the best, most popular stuff, but also want it to be interesting by including some surprise black sheep into the winners too, like Lilith.pk3.
The cacowards already seems weird enough that there are all these weird off-shoot awards like best programmer, gameplay mod, most creative endeavour, etc. Not that these people don't deserve credit, but it's also not really relevant for the majority of people who read it looking for good stuff to play. I personally just skimmed through the whole thing in a few minutes. The cacowards has kinda lost it's luster for me.
I think the amount of noise in the comments also seems to point to how few people care about Doom's birthday, and Linguica seems like he's on the edge of pulling the plug on the whole event. I really should come up with some sort of annual Doomer Boards Doom event for Doom's birthday because at this point I'm not sure doomworld will last another year without collapsing in on itself.
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xeepeep
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Post by xeepeep on Dec 11, 2017 9:36:35 GMT -5
^ Could you elaborate on the "Ling seems like he wants to pull the plug"? I'm not seeing that, but then again there's a lotta things I don't see.
Anyway, about the lilith drama, while I agree that it's a hell of a WAD, i have to agree with Graf on it not deserving to be alongside all those truly splendid wads that a buncha people put real effort into (Dunno about the "splendid" part though, I haven't played any of these). Glitch art should be kept to its niche IMO.
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Post by 40oz on Dec 11, 2017 10:04:18 GMT -5
Sure. I appreciate you asking,  I've been in the community for at least 6 of the annual doomworld cacowards, and I've never seen it completely at peace. There's always a bunch of "why did this win a cacoward and not that?" type posts that opened up the gates for some heated but generally civil discussion. The results of which were taken, digested, and applied in the next years event. (This is generally why we have some weird eccentric wads winning cacowards alongside some of the really special, professionally done ones) This year, that ice was broken by Graf Zahl, spoken in his usual unsatisfactory manner, and his post was met with extreme backlash from many different people who seem to just want a nice and peaceful Doom's day. These people don't seem to realize that by everyone attempting to stabilize the situation at once, they're all collectively ruining the party. It's strange how the backlash is disproportionately more extreme the less problem posts there are. In the post referenced above, Linguica observes this. Take for instance, this years "Mockaward." If the cacowards were mine, I could easily fight this trend by only rewarding wads that are actually funny rather than wads that are in the spirit of being destructive, until the problem eventually trickles away. It might take a year or two before people realize that terry wads aren't working, but its going to stop eventually. The message in the mockaward reports that they are putting this award to rest because it only seems to encourage bad wads. This seems to be a parallel to how Linguica and some of doomworld's moderators respond to forum activity by deleting posts, banning members, and locking threads. " If things aren't going the way I want it, SHUT IT DOWN." I think that post Linguica made is a pretty large nail in the Cacowards' coffin. If the pattern continues just as it always has (and it will,) the cacowards are just going to become a symbol of the doomworld forums at its worst. |
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xeepeep
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Post by xeepeep on Dec 11, 2017 10:39:18 GMT -5
You mean the "Some of you people are unbelievable" post? Haha, I thought the "some people" was referring to the dudes that made a huge drama about GZ's post, not GZ himself, heh. It doesn't seem like he's calling out GZ, really, more like trying to calm everyone down and prevent a shitfest.
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Post by Olroda on Dec 11, 2017 11:11:23 GMT -5
I really should come up with some sort of annual Doomer Boards Doom event for Doom's birthday... |
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Post by 40oz on Dec 11, 2017 11:22:06 GMT -5
You mean the "Some of you people are unbelievable" post? Haha, I thought the "some people" was referring to the dudes that made a huge drama about GZ's post, not GZ himself, heh. It doesn't seem like he's calling out GZ, really, more like trying to calm everyone down and prevent a shitfest. Exactly. Almost all of my "Everything Else" doomworld posts this year have been addressing that the community is not a happy friendly place like it purports itself to be. Linguica, and the other most vocal people on doomworld downplay my posts with responses that suggest that the problem is me, not them. Linguica has been enabling this destructive behavior for years. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2017 14:50:21 GMT -5
And Graf's post certainly wasn't tactful or diplomatic, but come on now. It's being called disgusting and abusive? When did we become such pussies that we feel abused by someone saying something was "visual garbage" or "mediocre"? Is it nice? No. But abusive? Jesus Christ, harden the fuck up Doomworld. Well as one of the abused authors  for a moment I thought to write something along the lines of "chill out guys, there's no need to be so outraged", my reaction to Graf's post was "lol", but later I thought that it would have probably added more fuel to the fire... |
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NuMetalManiak
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Post by NuMetalManiak on Dec 11, 2017 18:55:11 GMT -5
TNT Revilution being a runner-up is the same as Bloodstain and Hellbound being runners-up the last couple of years or so.
Also I think Graf got more abuse from the reactions moreso than whatever abusiveness they interpreted from his post.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2017 19:07:54 GMT -5
I don’t know what you mean by Bloodstain and Hellbound. If you are saying they were Cacoward worthy they most definitely were not. Great visuals on both but boring repetitive gameplay does not a cacoward winner make.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2017 20:28:06 GMT -5
Touching on 40’s posts, I don’t think the Cacowards are going away and I certainly didn’t get the same impression 40 did from ling’s post. People need to understand that they are arbitrary awards given by a select few who play a hell of a lot of Doom. The Brandon Lade-esque responses to the awards are certainly over the top and indeed quite stupid. As for Doomworld’s imminent demise, I don’t see it. It is still by a mile the preeminent site for all things Classic Doom in relation to knowledge and content. They have a healthy sized user base and it will most likely be the first (and last) stop for new people getting into Doom or for people rediscovering Doom. The atmosphere and vibe doesn’t appeal to all, but that’s obviously why this board exists.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 11, 2017 22:52:13 GMT -5
Well as one of the abused authors  for a moment I thought to write something along the lines of "chill out guys, there's no need to be so outraged", my reaction to Graf's post was "lol", but later I thought that it would have probably added more fuel to the fire... You're probably right about that. Like I said, Graf Zahl is known for being a curmudgeon and phrasing things bluntly and often rather rudely. What he said could have been said in a much better way that still expressed his opinion without directly denigrating another wad author. I do think everyone who won an award deserved to be recognized and all the projects are great projects in their own way. I think many people, including me, will have their own opinions about what wad is better than what other wad and why, and that's fine, but I would stop short of saying "X wad is garbage" unless it's WOW.wad or some such piss-awful purposefully bad tripe. That said, I just see a recent trend of people calling certain forms of speech "harassment", "abuse", or "bullying" when they are conducted in optional forums or webpages that no one is forced to go to and merely express controversial opinions, and when that kind of speech can be successfully labeled that way(and soon after restricted) we are one step closer to fascism. |
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for a moment I thought to write something along the lines of "chill out guys, there's no need to be so outraged", my reaction to Graf's post was "lol", but later I thought that it would have probably added more fuel to the fire...
for a moment I thought to write something along the lines of "chill out guys, there's no need to be so outraged", my reaction to Graf's post was "lol", but later I thought that it would have probably added more fuel to the fire...