40oz
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Post by 40oz on Jun 12, 2024 20:54:26 GMT -5
@dasho once again, this was already covered two weeks ago. Tangra said moments ago that the mental faculties of these mappers must be compromised to have an idea for a project in which straight people aren't entitled to intervene and because of that, it shouldn't exist (less maps/mappers for Doom). I said its valid for gay mappers to make maps for Doom with other gay mappers (more maps/mappers for Doom)
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 12, 2024 21:02:58 GMT -5
Correct; who is claiming that they are entitled to intervene, or has even done so? Unless your definition of intervention also encompasses "posting in that project's thread with a question or opinion."
To me, being "entitled" to "intervene" would be someone going into that thread and demanding the project be shut down with a reasonable expectation of it happening.
Again, Tangra expressed an OPINION that it shouldn't exist. Has Tangra actively tried to shut it down?
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Post by TimeOfDeath on Jun 12, 2024 22:54:19 GMT -5
It's interesting how people are getting banned from dw for "edgelording" when another member has a custom title that seems to be advocating for real physical violence.
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nnn✓ork
Doomer
Dr. Noisystein
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Post by nnn✓ork on Jun 12, 2024 23:06:35 GMT -5
Yup...
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VICE
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Post by VICE on Jun 12, 2024 23:59:11 GMT -5
You mentioned maybe mapping for DBP one day. There's no barrier of entry. if you're not sure about your mapping, feel free to goof around and post what you've got and I'll help give you some direction on how to get it over the finish line. Appreciated. I have a few ongoing maps I want to finish first for other projects I already signed up for, after that I'll look into it for sure. I want to get a few more maps done before I tackle this, I played the latest DBP and started playing the earlier ones in sequence recently, and they're fucking dope. They're actually better than what most established mappers in DW come up with IMO. That is one of the most jarring things on there and got a facepalm from me every single time I saw it. I reckon if DW keeps up this vector, 99% of their userbase will consist of either fags, furries, clueless kids or some combination thereof. Then again maybe that's what they're aiming for.
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Post by ketmar on Jun 13, 2024 2:18:40 GMT -5
so, "gay project" is ok, but simply wearing a "superstrahight" avatar is not ok. now i too believe that "gay project" should be nuked. thank you, DW moderators, for converting me from "meh, i don't care" to "burn this abomination with fire!"
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Post by thelokk on Jun 13, 2024 3:19:43 GMT -5
dont feel like they owe anyone any kind of explanation for what they do And, as you are / have been a long time moderator both here and there, hopefully I don't need to explain what's deeply wrong with this attitude. They dont get paid for moderating doomworld. Reminder that they can step down at any moment, no one is pointing a gun at anyone's head. They chose their own hell.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2024 4:00:58 GMT -5
Sorry this was unclear. The rebuttal is there's no reason to give a shit about this in the context of the Doom community because this is one instance of medical malpractice from before you and I were born, and the topic is about being banned from doomworld. It has no relevance. That's exactly the point I was illustrating in the story in the post you were responding to in the first place. Why don't you go write angry emails to a doctor or something? You can't make a case for why readers in the doom community have to be subjected to this. Aw man, I didn't get it; I thought we switched over to debating the mentioned concept abstractly. Sorry.
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40oz
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Post by 40oz on Jun 13, 2024 6:31:46 GMT -5
Correct; who is claiming that they are entitled to intervene, or has even done so? Unless your definition of intervention also encompasses "posting in that project's thread with a question or opinion." To me, being "entitled" to "intervene" would be someone going into that thread and demanding the project be shut down with a reasonable expectation of it happening. Again, Tangra expressed an OPINION that it shouldn't exist. Has Tangra actively tried to shut it down? youre asking me to point to evidence that has since been deleted from the thread, but yes exactly that. Lets say Japanese Community project started from someone saying " hey im looking for japanese people to get together and make maps together" And you (or anyone) responds " you guys should not speak japanese and speak english because thats what everyone already does also im not gonna help" What gives that person the audacity to say something like that? I'm not asking this facetiously. What service is this doing for the doom community? What do you suppose the Japanese people do with this opinion? Particularly on a largely english speaking forum where its highly unlikely for an english speaker to speak in opposition to their own native language just to hold space for japanese people to map together. If you wouldnt do this there, what makes it an exception when its gay and genderqueer people wanting to map together? This is already an enormous reach to allow you the platform to talk about their project from here, and by extension, giving gay and genderqueer doom players and mappers a clear visual that if they attempted to do anything Doom related with their identity exposed in some capacity, they would NEED to be questioned about it. Your avatar has a picture of a man in it. Could you imagine if every time you did anything for the doom community such as a map or music or code, there would be like a 40/60 split where some of the people would be like "hey this is cool good job" and the other 60% was like "cant you just do this without telling everyone youre man? Why do i need to know this?" Would you capitulate to not wear the avatar you like? How long do you have to deal with these responses to everything doom related that you do before youd realize this is all so so stupid and just give up and leave?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2024 8:29:39 GMT -5
youre asking me to point to evidence that has since been deleted from the thread, but yes exactly that. Lets say Japanese Community project started from someone saying " hey im looking for japanese people to get together and make maps together" And you (or anyone) responds " you guys should not speak japanese and speak english because thats what everyone already does also im not gonna help" What gives that person the audacity to say something like that? I'm not asking this facetiously. What service is this doing for the doom community? What do you suppose the Japanese people do with this opinion? Particularly on a largely english speaking forum where its highly unlikely for an english speaker to speak in opposition to their own native language just to hold space for japanese people to map together. If you wouldnt do this there, what makes it an exception when its gay and genderqueer people wanting to map together? This is already an enormous reach to allow you the platform to talk about their project from here, and by extension, giving gay and genderqueer doom players and mappers a clear visual that if they attempted to do anything Doom related with their identity exposed in some capacity, they would NEED to be questioned about it. Your avatar has a picture of a man in it. Could you imagine if every time you did anything for the doom community such as a map or music or code, there would be like a 40/60 split where some of the people would be like "hey this is cool good job" and the other 60% was like "cant you just do this without telling everyone youre man? Why do i need to know this?" Would you capitulate to not wear the avatar you like? How long do you have to deal with these responses to everything doom related that you do before youd realize this is all so so stupid and just give up and leave? Here's where we are simply going to just agree to disagree. I don't believe it is audacious to have an opinion or belief that runs counter to other peoples' and to express that on a public forum. If, for instance, the imaginary JCP post you mention was actually posted on a Japanese-hosted and primarily Japanese language server, then this might hold a little more weight. You could just as easily ask what good it does for the Doom community to do things like wail and moan about the evils of America and capitalism, or what good it does to make fun of Christians with "muh skydaddy" and "Christcuck", or potentially alienate Russian Doomers who simply live in a nation whose leader is portrayed as the comic book villain of the week and aren't necessarily involved in its conflicts, yet these things happen much more frequently and are moderated far less than anything that occurred in the GAYhem thread. Your avatar argument is very poorly timed seeing what happened to VICE, although I'm sure you will claim that that is somehow not the same as having rainbow or trans colors adorning your avatar.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2024 8:47:41 GMT -5
They'll be collectively fighting their urge to commit suicide?
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Post by Bob Page on Jun 13, 2024 16:01:39 GMT -5
It's interesting how people are getting banned from dw for "edgelording" when another member has a custom title that seems to be advocating for real physical violence. Honest question: Does trans genocide take place anywhere in the world right now? If so, I feel like it would be something that advocates of that lifestyle would point out with specific examples and statistics to make sure even cave-dwellers like myself were aware of it. Like are there certain countries where this happens? I've never been to Asia or the Middle East, so perhaps it's a thing in some countries in those regions?
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40oz
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Post by 40oz on Jun 13, 2024 16:47:35 GMT -5
A good starting off point might be to know what genocide is. To give one example, last year Texas succeeded in implementing legislation that would ban gender-affirming health care to people of all ages. Recently, as a result of lawsuits to appeal the provision that was made last year, a small victory was awarded when an injunction was made that the Texas Department of Family and Protective Services can't qualify it as child abuse and take a parent's children away for seeking this kind of care. People had to hire lawyers, prepare a case, sue, and engage in long court battles for people that would benefit from this kind of health care. This is one element of a bunch of provisions in this bill that need to be dealt with one-by-one. This is an example of what "fighting trans genocide" means. www.aclutx.org/en/press-releases/texas-appeals-court-upholds-rulings-blocking-state-investigating-trans-youth-and#:~:text=The%20injunction%20bars%20DFPS%20from,Civil%20Liberties%20Union%20Jon%20L.
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NuMetalManiak
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Post by NuMetalManiak on Jun 13, 2024 17:55:42 GMT -5
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CittyKat112
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Post by CittyKat112 on Jun 13, 2024 21:57:41 GMT -5
A good starting off point might be to know what genocide is. To give one example, last year Texas succeeded in implementing legislation that would ban gender-affirming health care to people of all ages. Recently, as a result of lawsuits to appeal the provision that was made last year, a small victory was awarded when an injunction was made that the Texas Department of Family and Protective Services can't qualify it as child abuse and take a parent's children away for seeking this kind of care. People had to hire lawyers, prepare a case, sue, and engage in long court battles for people that would benefit from this kind of health care. This is one element of a bunch of provisions in this bill that need to be dealt with one-by-one. This is an example of what "fighting trans genocide" means. www.aclutx.org/en/press-releases/texas-appeals-court-upholds-rulings-blocking-state-investigating-trans-youth-and#:~:text=The%20injunction%20bars%20DFPS%20from,Civil%20Liberties%20Union%20Jon%20L. Yeah, that totally falls into definition of genocide... *facepalm* Every time you try to talk about politics, it turns into THIS. And it ain't a good look 40.
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VICE
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Post by VICE on Jun 13, 2024 23:38:14 GMT -5
Banning non critical non medical body intervention ≠ murder Troonies ≠ a genus
Definitions skewed and blown way out of proportion as always for these lot.
Also their reliance on gender affirming care and artificial intervention proves the entire thing is epigenetic anyway, and at the very least if not banned should be completely privatized.
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RastaManGames
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Post by RastaManGames on Jun 14, 2024 0:28:48 GMT -5
Sorry that happened to you. It does suck that doomworld snipes people out there based on their participation here. The "witchhunt" protocol were always a thing for "TroonWorld" mods and their loyal watchdogs.
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VICE
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Post by VICE on Jun 14, 2024 1:09:55 GMT -5
Ya'll witchhunters can suck on my crystal balls. And don't forget to work the staff. 🧙♂️
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2024 4:05:35 GMT -5
take a parent's children away for seeking this kind of care. SLOW your roll; How would a child not only understand, but reasonbly consent to "gender affirming" care? And what does said "care" affirm? How does intake of potentially harmful narcotics and mutilating surgery "Affirm" anything? Good thing Texas banned that, children should be left alone.
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StodgyAyatollah
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I'm not here. You're just imagining things.
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Post by StodgyAyatollah on Jun 14, 2024 7:32:52 GMT -5
Anyone who's listened to enough detrans stories know with a fair degree of clarity that young people who have not processed their experienced traumas are often being love bombed into bad decisions which cause further trauma by ideologues who treat such things flippantly while also exploited for profit by the medical industry.
This also muddies things for proper treatment and understanding of actual trans people, interfering with them getting proper care because the tent has been made so wide. And also dragging them through political mud they don't deserve. It's all an ugly mess that usually turns into 'my team is morally superior' bullshit instead of honesty.
What is clear though is that children need to be off the table until they are old enough to process and examine these things with clarity. Anything short of that deserves unambiguous condemnation.
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Post by slavicpainter on Jun 14, 2024 9:44:46 GMT -5
A good starting off point might be to know what genocide is. To give one example, last year Texas succeeded in implementing legislation that would ban gender-affirming health care to people of all ages. Recently, as a result of lawsuits to appeal the provision that was made last year, a small victory was awarded when an injunction was made that the Texas Department of Family and Protective Services can't qualify it as child abuse and take a parent's children away for seeking this kind of care. People had to hire lawyers, prepare a case, sue, and engage in long court battles for people that would benefit from this kind of health care. This is one element of a bunch of provisions in this bill that need to be dealt with one-by-one. This is an example of what "fighting trans genocide" means. www.aclutx.org/en/press-releases/texas-appeals-court-upholds-rulings-blocking-state-investigating-trans-youth-and#:~:text=The%20injunction%20bars%20DFPS%20from,Civil%20Liberties%20Union%20Jon%20L. One hell of a way outing yourself as a paedophile, Shirley.
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40oz
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Post by 40oz on Jun 14, 2024 12:19:03 GMT -5
take a parent's children away for seeking this kind of care. SLOW your roll; How would a child not only understand, but reasonbly consent to "gender affirming" care? And what does said "care" affirm? How does intake of potentially harmful narcotics and mutilating surgery "Affirm" anything? Good thing Texas banned that, children should be left alone. The same way any child gets any kind of health care. They would have parental supervision.
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Post by Bob Page on Jun 14, 2024 12:52:34 GMT -5
I watched a video awhile back titled "The Memory Wars". The content creator is fantastic in my opinion. For anyone who cares, here's the link:
The basic idea is that humans are highly suggestible, and if something is asked of them enough times in the right ways, they will eventually begin to doubt their own recollections and essentially create memories whole cloth that never actually happened. This is particularly effective on children for obvious reasons. I believe that a similar principle applies to questions or subtle insinuations surrounding immutable characteristics like someone's gender or perceived identity. I do think that it is likely remarkably easy to basically steer your child into believing that they are a gender which doesn't align to their physical body and DNA. I'm not suggesting that I know how often this does or does not occur, but it follows reason that it has occurred before, in light of the amount of people who endeavor to switch back to their original gender or express regret about their choice to take hormones or undergo surgery.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 14, 2024 12:53:41 GMT -5
If gender is a "social construct", and thus completely subjective and malleable, why is "gender affirming care", specifically the “administration of puberty-blocking drugs or supraphysiologic[al] doses of testosterone and estrogen” mentioned in the ruling you link necessary? Why is denying these procedures, which again should not have any impact on gender as it is (according to you) completely distinct from sex and genetic/biological characteristics, a step towards "genocide"?
Additionally, why has the LGBT/etc community so willingly and completely embraced the first two steps towards their own genocide that you've linked, "Classification" and "Symbolization"?
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Post by deathevokation on Jun 14, 2024 13:02:20 GMT -5
SLOW your roll; How would a child not only understand, but reasonbly consent to "gender affirming" care? And what does said "care" affirm? How does intake of potentially harmful narcotics and mutilating surgery "Affirm" anything? Good thing Texas banned that, children should be left alone. The same way any child gets any kind of health care. They would have parental supervision. Parental supervision doesn't mean anything if your parents are insane.
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