good-old
Doomer
18 year old dumb kid.
Posts: 421
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Post by good-old on Dec 30, 2021 9:38:13 GMT -5
Post reviews of any kind of doom mod, whether it's a Total Conversion or a level or simply a resource like a weapon or a monster. Review anything that's created for Doom. Let's see how this one goes.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2021 15:00:32 GMT -5
To illustrate the point i was making on the "The death of reviewers" thread, this kind of template Komori's provided it's perfect for a pwad review. Short, to the point, no unecessary padding, no pretentiousness "you should had done x or y in map w or z", no typical /idgames nitpicking and anachronisms and best of all; easy to skip thru if you just want to pick some info but don't want to read the whole thing and "spoil" your first impressions. Now, i think that if needed you can stretch this to a few more lines - but extend it too much then it becomes the usual caco/webzine material. but I swear to God that if 40oz starts a rambling to raise awereness to poorly-detailed .txt files that don't describes what to expect in the mapset.. i'll flood the random 2 thread with low-effort posting and gladly take the ban
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good-old
Doomer
18 year old dumb kid.
Posts: 421
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Post by good-old on Dec 31, 2021 12:36:31 GMT -5
@pintolinh0 Oh damn that thread. There's definitely a language barrier, a bad translator maybe, cause I remember JadingTsunami saying there were no universal standards and then you saying they don't exist in an argumentative manner, as if JT said there were such things.
A review should detail everything the wad has that's just what reviews do, but a description in a .txt is what should only give a short text on what to expect.(not to say Komori's reviews weren't proper ones, though. Speaking of which, I might try those two wads sometime.)
Also this isn't DW, you won't get banned for pretty much everything lmao
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joe-ilya
Hey, Ron! Can we say 'fuck' in the game?
a simple word, a simple turd
Posts: 3,072
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Post by joe-ilya on Dec 31, 2021 15:55:03 GMT -5
One point of discontent that is most fresh in my memory — is combat set piece in the form of honeycomb. That area constantly fills up with hordes of monsters, all while floor plates submerge revealing damaging floor and emerge in no apparent order. It's creative but claustrophobic and confusing fight where it's pretty hard to avoid damage, and it's also placed right at the level's end. Otherwise, Arceon is a great fit for a laid-back smooth playthrough. Agreed with this part, that's the only part I felt was unfair in the whole mapset.
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Post by lunchlunch on Jan 1, 2022 17:40:33 GMT -5
One point of discontent that is most fresh in my memory — is combat set piece in the form of honeycomb. That area constantly fills up with hordes of monsters, all while floor plates submerge revealing damaging floor and emerge in no apparent order. It's creative but claustrophobic and confusing fight where it's pretty hard to avoid damage, and it's also placed right at the level's end. Otherwise, Arceon is a great fit for a laid-back smooth playthrough. Agreed with this part, that's the only part I felt was unfair in the whole mapset. Double agree. It's a neat idea but it's difficult to tell what pattern the trail takes through the honeycomb, especially while trying to kite the horde. You're guaranteed to take at least some damage unless you've played it so many times you have some sort of speedrun strat that's choreographed to hell. It's not majorly offensive but it's a pretty big hiccup in an otherwise masterpiece of a map.
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joe-ilya
Hey, Ron! Can we say 'fuck' in the game?
a simple word, a simple turd
Posts: 3,072
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Post by joe-ilya on Jan 1, 2022 18:15:20 GMT -5
I got through it with spare health on my second try once I knew where the AVs were.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2022 19:28:25 GMT -5
@pintolinh0 Oh damn that thread. There's definitely a language barrier, a bad translator maybe, cause I remember JadingTsunami saying there were no universal standards and then you saying they don't exist in an argumentative manner, as if JT said there were such things. A review should detail everything the wad has that's just what reviews do, but a description in a .txt is what should only give a short text on what to expect.(not to say Komori's reviews weren't proper ones, though. Speaking of which, I might try those two wads sometime.) Also this isn't DW, you won't get banned for pretty much everything lmao I'll attempt in not going full derail mode here, but pardon me if i fail miserably. 1) Yes, we might have language barriers here and there 'cause both translators i use (my own gulliver and google translator) are very flawed. Nonetheless i think there were a clear distinction between the way Jtsunami and I talked about universal standards from the moment i jump in the discussion until his last post. I'm gonna do my best to showcase that below, but JadingTsunami feel free to correct me if i'm being unfair here. I'll paraphrase some parts but i suggest revisiting the 1st page of the thread if you're interested.
- Jtsunami: "I've had the same level ranked both "best" and "worst" in a WAD by different reviewers. There are no set standards."
- Me: "I'm pretty sure there's standards, just not yours(...)" - Jtsunami: "When I say "no set standards" I mean no universal standards.(...)" - Me: "(...)There's no floating criteria around us to intuitivally inform wheter a map is good or not my dude. A standard/template/model is determined by a group in order to control, to narrow down things, to select a particular approach(...) So pretty please educate me, why does a particular criteria/standard must be set "universally" to critique a fuckin' mapset? Why would anyone do that if not to select, control and enforce the flux of those preferable designs?" - Jtsunami "(...)When I wrote "[T]here are no set standards," it means only that: maps are judged by the individual based on how much fun they had while playing. Of course I don't think a universal standard can or even should exist. This would be like saying only one type of music should exist. I don't want to derail things any further, so I think it is enough to say I agree with the points that have been made and I always did."
I think it's pretty clear that while we ended up in a agreement, it wasn't the case until further argumentation cleared things up - as he brought up the term in a discontented manner, implying the opposite. Given the context of the entirety of Jtsunami's first post, to me was very clear that his conclusion to 40oz's midlife crisis thread was; that reviewers should set a particular standard for their critique, otherwise reviews would either fall to pure hype or as a deflection mechanism. While also attributing that the reason reviewers fail in not seeing the value in spending their time and energy to adopt such approach is because nowadays catering for internet attention is easier. If Jtsunami find this to be a fair assessment of his opinion/argument, we can continue. 2) "A review should detail everything the wad has that's just what reviews do(...)" I vehemently disagree with your affirmation. I think that in the case of pwads; you shouldn't provide more than a brief summary of what to expect, based entirely on the reviewer's own gut and fairness* - and not on any non-personal-predetermined-standard. The whole point of playing a pwad is to experience the maps for yourself. You will not be able to maintan coeherency in your reviews if you decide to ejaculate flowery adjectives and vague subjective nitpickings all over the place. And i find quite bizarre that someone that subscribes by what you affirmed can't see the cloud of smug surrounding his own head. Again, mapsets aren't movies or books - there just isn't a notorious amount of information needed to be decompressed or that will require a specialist to pin point specifics in order for the player to perceive what he (or her) will already perceive automatically when playing the damn thing. We dont need to agree on this. We don't need to respect each others opinions on this. The best we can offer is tolerance, as in we don't partake in erradicating/censoring each other's opinons and find a common ground when possible. But that doesn't mean that we need to adopt the empty sense of politeness and respectfulness so commonly present on DW. So let's bash heads. * as in understanding that your impressions will be unavoidably subjective, so focusing too much attention on particularities will result in incoherency
3) "Also this isn't DW, you won't get banned for pretty much everything lmao" As much as I have a genuine appreciation for 40oz's tough skin when dealing with sensitive topics and usual annoyances. No, you sure will be banned from here if you cross certain lines as this wasn't my first acc on the boards. Before entering or registering in any kind of discord server, subreddit, etc. i'll make a dummy/troll acc first so i can measure the boundaries of the admins patience instead of discovering it accidentally. So given the chance i'll be as mean spirited, cringe and obnoxious as possible in order to know with a better degree or certainty the kind of topics and word usage that wouldn't be tolerated. If i'm ok with it, then i proceed in making my "real" acc. If not, i go the lurking ways if possible. I was IP banned and i don't use vpns in this cases, so if 40oz has access to IP addresses, he surely can connect the dots.
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good-old
Doomer
18 year old dumb kid.
Posts: 421
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Post by good-old on Jan 3, 2022 10:50:32 GMT -5
" A review should detail everything the wad has that's just what reviews do(...)" I vehemently disagree with your affirmation. I think that in the case of pwads; you shouldn't provide more than a brief summary of what to expect, based entirely on the reviewer's own gut and fairness* - and not on any non-personal-predetermined-standard. The whole point of playing a pwad is to experience the maps for yourself. You will not be able to maintan coeherency in your reviews if you decide to ejaculate flowery adjectives and vague subjective nitpickings all over the place. And i find quite bizarre that someone that subscribes by what you affirmed can't see the cloud of smug surrounding his own head. Again, mapsets aren't movies or books - there just isn't a notorious amount of information needed to be decompressed or that will require a specialist to pin point specifics in order for the player to perceive what he (or her) will already perceive automatically when playing the damn thing. We dont need to agree on this. We don't need to respect each others opinions on this. The best we can offer is tolerance, as in we don't partake in erradicating/censoring each other's opinons and find a common ground when possible. But that doesn't mean that we need to adopt the empty sense of politeness and respectfulness so commonly present on DW. So let's bash heads. The reason I said that is because that's literally what the term review means. I still think level design does deserve a bit more words, I mean yeah it's not the same as an entire game, but you can describe some things objectively such as the under/over usage of weapons, like a TC where you have 9 weapons while all of them are unique, but out of the many levels, you are provided enough ammo for only 3 of them. Not having a reason to use X after you obtain weapon Y, or not having a reason to use an altfire can be considered a good one as well. For monster packs, there can be things like an extremely vertical monster ladder with the imp replacement being incredibly easy to deal with while the caco replacement being able to kill you in a second, or the under/over usage of them just like the weapons, or placing them in a way they can be easily "cheesed" are some. Yes, reviews can have some subjectivity, but there are enough objective things to talk about. " Also this isn't DW, you won't get banned for pretty much everything lmao" As much as I have a genuine appreciation for 40oz's tough skin when dealing with sensitive topics and usual annoyances. No, you sure will be banned from here if you cross certain lines as this wasn't my first acc on the boards. Before entering or registering in any kind of discord server, subreddit, etc. i'll make a dummy/troll acc first so i can measure the boundaries of the admins patience instead of discovering it accidentally. So given the chance i'll be as mean spirited, cringe and obnoxious as possible in order to know with a better degree or certainty the kind of topics and word usage that wouldn't be tolerated. If i'm ok with it, then i proceed in making my "real" acc. If not, i go the lurking ways if possible. I was IP banned and i don't use vpns in this cases, so if 40oz has access to IP addresses, he surely can connect the dots. I should rephrase it. What I meant was, you will not get banned for the slightest offense(which usually isn't even an offense in the first place) unlike you would on DW. Also thanks for the troll account idea, it actually is a good way to decide if a community is worth entering, not gonna lie. Although I don't think I'll ever go to such places again.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 4, 2022 13:17:42 GMT -5
Not speaking for anyone in particular, but to come up with a balanced, i.e. enjoyable level experience for the target player can be very taxing enough as it is. I think that non game-breaking flaws are there to be a part of project's personality, no need to be overly critical of someone's fruit of labor, or moreover — to strive for questionably achievable glinting perfection, since such unending ordeal most often leads to results from bad to mediocre. The best and most pleasant feedback a creator can get is from seeing how much people enjoy their work despite all those established "renowned creative figures" around. Share mutual respect during conversation, for no one knows what lenghts of effort the creator has been through, and as for the rest, let his own conscience guide him. good-old the quote above represents 100% of what i'm trying to say. In retrospect, i think that i'll step out of this topic for the moment. Not only it's going circular but also in both 40oz's thread, and on this one, other users accurately presented my stance on this subject way better than i did. But as a closing argument; even tho review has a fixed meaning across medias, the tools and criteria one might use to write a review will differ depending on the media format - so in the case of pwads, mapsets, megawads, etc. i find that the way most reviewers approach them are often inappropriate and involved in unnecessary pedantry*. And imho the suggestions and conclusions that were presented at the original thread, like 'doubling down on the nitpicking/subjective aspect' or 'splitting reviews into subdivisions' or 'having a centralized place to host them' or 'relying on content creators as an autorithy to improve feedback income' - are horrendous and poorly thought out, not differing in the slightest of what we currently have.. instead, just inverts the interest group.
*as in using a screwdriver to forcely open a device case, it might do the job but at the cost of damaging the structure - a reviewer using a movie or a videogame template to write a pwad critique, for example, will not only risk exposing more visual information than necessary but also digressing about aspects that are easily aprenhedable by the player and ultimately are an intrinsic part of the wad format. Therefore spoiling parts of the experience and branding mapsets for nothing but a petty sense of self-importance. Again: new mappers, community projects, playtesting etc. requires and welcomes a more in-depth analysis - so constructive criticism, picking standards and overall help are necessities in those cases.
Also thanks for the troll account idea, it actually is a good way to decide if a community is worth entering, not gonna lie. Although I don't think I'll ever go to such places again. Mind you, it's not a foolproof method and depending on recent precedents at the interested place, you wouldn't even need to make a dummy acc. But it's a very good method to test the swimmable level on murky waters.
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good-old
Doomer
18 year old dumb kid.
Posts: 421
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Post by good-old on Jan 6, 2022 3:48:20 GMT -5
Mind you, it's not a foolproof method and depending on recent precedents at the interested place, you wouldn't even need to make a dummy acc. But it's a very good method to test the swimmable level on murky waters. Usually offending posts are deleted so it can still be useful. Even if they aren't deleted, who cares, it's fun to do. And yeah, I'll let the "review" topic be since there's quite a lot of things I'm probably not getting(not blaming you though)
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good-old
Doomer
18 year old dumb kid.
Posts: 421
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Post by good-old on Jan 7, 2022 8:07:44 GMT -5
Anyway finally for another on-topic post:(My first review ever? Maybe Probably Definitely a waste of time to read) Back when there wasn't a "true" way to reload weapons in ZDoom, Xaser found a way to do so using ACS, but since a single map with a reloading weapon didn't exactly sound like the best way to showcase a milestone in Doom modding, the community got Zen Dynamics.
Zen Dynamics is a partial conversion mod and has a lot more than simply reloading weapons, and the rest of the stuff is not just there for the sake of being there, I wouldn't have guessed it was made just for the reloading trick if I played it before reading the text file. Yes, not all of the wad is top-notch, but it still turns out to be an enjoyable experience.
The story is the best thing about this mod, and I wouldn't say anything about it, the intro does so way better.
The weapons themselves are higher in power than their Doom counterparts, which is balanced by the levels being difficult. They have alt-fires(save for the SSG replacement), reloading(duh), and select/deselect animations. There are sounds for all of these too. Berserks are portables here, known as "Zen-roids" and they appear as separate weapons(even these have alt-fires! You can use their syringes to attack monsters), doing the same job as the vanilla equivalent, only doubling the damage output instead of multiplying it by 10, since the machete you get is pretty much a straight upgrade over the fist. The pistol replacement is the "viper" which borrows almost everything from the Half-life magnum. It has the same firing sound,has ammo which isn't very common later into the game, and is quite powerful. However, it does look different, with a sci-fi design, and it's alt-fire shoots all the remaining bullets in the cylinder, which is now part of the barrel. The streetsweeper is the shotgun replacement which looks like a Thompson that shoots 12 gauges instead of .45 ACPs, but for something with a drum magazine, I expected a higher fire rate. It's alt-fire accumulates more shells, to deal with the bigger monsters. The ego smasher is a more powerful SSG with a higher fire rate, and is fed with 8 shell chains. The Zen-II is the high firerate weapon, with a ChaosZero variant that uses the same ammo but has more power for a lower firerate, and both of them have burstfire alt-fires. There's an assault rifle with an attached grenade launcher. There's also a nailgun that resembles its Quake counterpart, this time in every way, with an alt-fire that spreads the nails 5 at a time in a spread similar to the vanilla shotgun's. And of course, what good is a sci-fi mod without plasma weapons? You have the Plasma SMGs(yes, you heard that right)which are dual wielded and have a projectile based alt-fire, a fusion cannon that feels like a different version of the BFG, and a railgun which can also shoot projectiles that go through enemies. The rocket launcher replacement, the Scorcher is like a powerup, it's very powerful, but it isn't there when you need it the most; the boss fight. There's a weapon that is best not talked about.
Most of the monsters are modified versions of some of the originals. The maelstrom's ranged attack is one that spreads out in flames when it hits, which can drop your health very quickly. For something that's based on a lost soul and is supposed to appear in the same places as mid tier monsters like the caco, it's not really what you call balance. The cacophyte is a similar one, but it's difference is way lower than the maelstrom. The tortured soul shoots out poisonous fume that is quite powerful, and an incredibly fast projectile as a ranged attack. It is similar to the pain elemental in that it can be dangerous if left alive for long. The hell guard has about the same health as a revenant and shoots three lightning balls consecutively at a time, which is a bit hard to dodge at times. The arachnophyte is a flying spider mastermind with lower health. The imp warlord is an "intelligent" enemy in that it blocks your attacks with its shield when you try to attack it, so you will have a hard time trying to kill it with a rapidfire weapon like an SMG. It has 4 kinds of attacks, one of which include spawning a bat! The shield bouncing away when it's killed is a nice reward for killing it. There's also the hell's battery, which almost functions entirely like a boss because of its multiple attacks and occasional invincibility like the imp warlord, but the mod's weapons don't make it feel like one. The actual boss of this one is something that I won't talk about, again, just for the story.
The level design does the job of creating the atmospheres they were supposed to quite well, but you'll encounter quite a lot of areas that are barely enough for the player to move, and it feels like they were playtested with a Doom mod that makes the player smaller, so the playtester didn't notice anything wrong with the maps. They are hard in that they don't have that much health, but the better weapons balance it. You'll also end up leaving the map leaving a ton of ammo behind, so you can finish the game without ever touching a couple of the weapons, maybe even complete it with just one of them. This also makes pistol starts doable, which might not have been purposefully implemented, looking at the fact that they're basically doing a map without half of the weapons you're supposed to have, although the ammo for some of the weapons like the Viper, the Fusion Cannon and the Zen-II/ChaosZero isn't as common as the others. You can sometimes get lost in the maps, but there's an objective screen which can tells you what to do. A common sight in the later levels is the baby mancubi, which are simply decorations, but they block and are shootable and break when they die, and the variant that is stuck to the roof has a part of it falling down when it dies. Depending on how much you hate mancubi, you'll love killing these. Another nice effect is the falling floor, which unfortunately isn't a common sight in the levels and is seen only once or twice. One of the levels needs you to exit the level in time after heavily damaging the reactor, before it explodes.
The music for this mod wasn't specifically composed for it except for a couple of tracks, but it fits the mod quite well. It's mostly techno, but you probably would have guessed.
Overall, it's a cool mod that just feels like it wasn't playtested in a couple of places, but it's definitely worth a try if you like weapon mods and specific levels for them.
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Post by middleclassworm on Feb 8, 2022 5:38:05 GMT -5
Technicolor Antichrist Box/ Technicolor Anniversary Box (2020/2021) – by Major Arlene
Void as a theme in Doom mapping has a long history, but it was never really that popular until the last few years. It’s hard to pinpoint the exact moment when void maps became The Shit, but I think it was around 2018 – success of Void & Rainbow by _Mud, and the start of Refracted Reality project (then known as Infinite Void) was a decisive factor that kick-started theme’s popularity. The theme is divisive as it’s popular, though – and some malicious tongues even claimed that most of the recent neon-fueled GZdoom void maps were made in bad faith, in attempt to cater for Cacoward’s committee tastes. Technicolor Antichrist Box by Major Arlene was the most controversial of the bunch – mostly for the reasons, that had nothing to do with the map itself. I will make an attempt to review this map, disregarding all of the drama around it and see how it holds up on its own merit. First of all, map comes with (and designed for) the Supercharge mod, and if you don’t know, what that is – you will most likely have a bad time for that reason alone, since the map expects from you knowledge of the mods mechanics.
Secondly, there are two versions of the map – original and anniversary remaster. Main difference is in visuals – while the original has somewhat cold blue-pink color scheme, remaster shifts to more warm and pleasant colors of orange and purple. The map itself remains mostly the same – there are few new custom monsters, but they don’t change the encounters that much.
At the start of the map, I had three things on my mind. First one – “Damn, that looks kinda cool”. Second – “Those sniper monsters probably will be pain in the ass for maxers”. And the third one – “Jesus, what a lag”. This map is not near the scale of Ar Luminae or Bastion of Chaos, but it can compete with them in terms of massive FPS drops. Thank God for OpGL ES in the latest version of GZDoom. Just don’t look up.
First serious encounter, and the first disappointment – once you clear the arachnotrons on the second floor, trash on the first one instantly stop possessing any threat. Thanks to janky 3d floors, monsters just love to stuck on those big stairs. Encounter would be slightly more interesting if the caged Diabolists under the stairs would be set free, but nope – they remains caged, which makes them the most useless enemies on the map. Overall, the room feels way too big and flat (despite having two floors) for this kind of encounter – even on the first floor you can easily outmaneuver your opposition. You can go in two different directions from now one – both housing one key each, for the switches in the main hall. One route will give you a plasma gun, other – SSG. Since SSG route is harder, I’d recommend go for the plasma first.
Difficulty from now on is consistent in its inconsistency. Example: Spider Mastermind fight is barely a fight (you can even telefrag this poor thing), but plasma gun fight is obnoxiously hard – you barely had a room to move. It’s a contrast shower – or piss easy, or borderline unfair, but rarely something in-between. Worst offender of the later is the cyberdemon fight in the pit – it’s the hardest fight in the whole map by a large margin. Escaping the pit means praying to RNGesus to not catch a rocket or be blocked by monsters at top, and fight a cybie in this enclosed space, while being assaulted by revenants from all sides is downright unpleasant. Final showdown in the main hall is even easier than the first fight. Kill a bunch of archviles under the stairs and you can safely use all the space in the room that you need. Cyberdemons tend to stuck under those stairs (hello, 3D floors, we meet again), which makes whole encounter even more trivial.
Overall, it’s hard to find a single unequivocally positive moment in this map aside from the map’s visuals – difficulty is very inconsistent, monster usage (despite having a large amount of custom monsters) is mostly inefficient, a few fights can be cheesed. Some fights feels like an afterthought – a common trope for Hellforge mappers, sadly. Remaster is a missed opportunity, since all the maps problems are still completely intact. Despite this, you can feel a lot of effort that was put into this and for a novice mapper – it’s a big success to make something so ambitious and, overall, somewhat competent.
But let’s not forget - this map was chosen as a runner-up for Cacowards. With this map symbolic A FUCKING MERCH was sold. And finally, author herself acts like a freaking rock star, refusing to listen to any criticism of her work. Well, so be it.
2/5 stars
Chad Kroeger is also a rock star, you know.
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