Post by mayhemicdestrvctor on Dec 1, 2021 23:38:38 GMT -5
At war with satan is the name of my doom wad. ive started out with mapping and have created 9 maps, the last one isnt finished yet tho but it will be at some point. I have put lots of effort and playtesting and refining the monster and ammo balance and stuff while trying to have the wad looking good, here are some screenshots: imgur.com/a/FXPEPox
hope you ll enjoy and give me some feedback and mapping advice n stuff about it please also be honest and harsh if you find something you really need to criticise no need to be unecessarily nice
1 fixed ceiling textures , enemy place ment , ammo placement , hp place ment , certain items placement , some textures and vanilla bugs are fixed so u can play in crispydoom with less issues and map 8 was fixed , map 9 is fixed and map 10 is added and map 11 is started but only has an exit and a few imps so u don 't get boring while u look at the unfinished layout
Post by mayhemicdestrvctor on Dec 2, 2021 1:28:28 GMT -5
ugh ... you cant actually criticize anything but you had fun? does that mean you just think its perfect or at least near perfection ? or something? well if yes thanks a whole lot for playing 7 maps in a row
Post by mayhemicdestrvctor on Dec 2, 2021 3:37:56 GMT -5
damn , yea this must probably mean something you somehow had fun with that even tho this isnt even your go to genre i wonder what people who actually rlly like this type of map would think of it and yea np
i know about these lumps and all but im not rlly good with that i tried it but i wasnt rlly sure if it even worked at all ?
to the teleport thing you said im not rlly sure what you re talking about tbf but thanks none the less whatever i did you seem to like it
Some general thoughts- Not bad for your first maps. There's some interesting ideas and the visuals are really nice, particularly your lighting effects. There's an old-school feel to the maps and some of the cave sections even reminded me of Sigil. Your enemy placements are usually good, seems like you have an understanding of the monsters' strengths. You place a limited but fair amount of health in your maps. That's not the case with ammo, which you do not place near enough of. Keep in mind that you know the position of every single enemy and every item placement in the map, and you will know exactly when to use what ammo on what enemies and how to best line up your shots to conserve the most amount of ammo, and you probably aren't missing many of your shots either because you've played the map multiple times and developed the muscle memory for it. Other players will not have these same advantages that you have. My personal rule of thumb is I take whatever amount of ammo that I need to beat my own map and add an additional 20-30% for other players. Here is a link to my demos- (https://doomshack.org/uploads/AWWSDemos.zip) If you're not used to watching demos, you should definitely start. You can try your best to envision how other players will approach your maps but it's a completely different thing to see how players actually do play through your maps. You can see where players got lost or stuck, needed more health, got fucked over because they don't know the map like you do, etc.
MAP01 Good enemy placement and ammo balance in this map. Has an old-school feel to it. Nice visuals, I like the scene. Pretty small but works well for a first map. Some of the barrels were a little useless since they were too far away from the imps, could be moved over. The spectres are too hard to see with the bright flashing lights.
MAP02 Kind of neat that the opening of this map looks similar to the first map, it follows a theme. Didn't appreciate the trap near the yellow key that teleports you into the previous room except now you're completely surrounded by new enemies. There's not enough room in there for the amount of enemies thrown at you and a player can be blocked off in that situation. Even if that teleporter wasn't there and you're just supposed to turn around and re-clear out that room I don't think that's a very enjoyable fight. It would feel less clunky and more fun to just build a new arena. If you can organically loop a player back to a previous area, like a hub,then revisiting an arena for another fight could be cool, but you should change the architecture and therefore the dynamics of a fight when you reuse an arena. (i.e. open up the room, raise pillars, lower certain walls, things like that) There doesn't seem to be enough ammo in the last half of this map. Didn't want to deal with the remaining enemies because of these conditions so I just went through the exit. Missing ceiling textures in areas.
MAP03 The SSG at the beginning should be brighter, it blends into the shadows and I didn't even notice it until about my fourth attempt. I liked the fight behind the blue key door. Ran out of ammo at the end, so I couldn't kill everything and had to just run for the exit. I point out some misaligned textures and there's another missing ceiling texture. Something I thought about was that your caves look natural but in contrast, your man-made environments can be a little too boxy, you should experiment more with nonorthogonal walls.
MAP04 Disliked this. There's not enough ammo and the setup in the beginning sucks. You have to wait on a slow door that practically guarantees you're going to get hit by arachnotron projectiles. The switch inside this room that raises the bridge goes unnoticed at first because the switch texture is above Doomguy's eye level. In order to not run out of ammo, I was forced to try corner peeking the two arachnotrons with my pistol and punching out the two pinkies without berserk. Not at all enjoyable. When you open up the door that the arachnotrons are guarding, another door opens behind you releasing a bunch of pinkies but you don't hear it open so it felt unfair when I was suddenly gang raped from behind without warning. It's difficult but for the wrong reasons IMO. The cramped layout and enemy placements were unacommadating in a way that felt more sloppy or tedious. If you were to place even just one box of shells near the beginning, this could fix most of that and be a lot more enjoyable. I actually liked the layout of this map from what I saw, but the lack of ammo makes it very annoying.
MAP05 I love the single barreled shotgun but I got bored of shooting midtier monsters with it. For example, the hell knights at the beginning of this map aren't very threatening, they're just tedious to kill. One with the two revenants would be better. Midtier monsters especially become tedious to kill when you don't give out enough shells in your maps and the player has to resort to plinking away with the pistol. You give out a rocket launcher near the end of the map but nobody besides you is going to know that it's there until the fight is over I don't think. Think about it, a player is suddenly faced with two mancubi and a teleporting archvile and they're supposed to react to this dangerous situation by wandering around the corner behind them on the offchance an inconspicuous wall has opened up to reveal a rocket launcher? Weapon placements should be obvious, especially when they're vital. Something you could do is place a window into the rocket launcher room so the player can first see that it's there and then when the fight happens they'll actually know to go check out this cubby. Another thing I thought about in this map is that it's not always immediately obvious where you're supposed to go in these maps. Something I like to do is brighten up doorways and switches to make navigation/progression more obvious.
MAP06 Layout-wise, this is the best map of the set so far, with the way it wraps around itself, opens up on itself, uses verticality well, etc. It looks really good too, probably my favorite of these. Another thing this map does well is its use of monster closets. It's easy to miss the SSG at the beginning of the map simply by choosing to go down the left path before going down the right. In the dark computer room, there's a pinky and a cacodemon stuck inside of each other so they can't move. This map has the opposite problem from your other maps, there's plenty of ammo but a very stingy amount of health. I died to an archvile in a long, open room full of hitscanners. Anytime you have hitscanners, especially an archvile, that room needs to have cover. Even a single 16 unit wide pillar is helpful. I didn't like dying that way, and I didn't like the lack of health, so I DNF the map.
MAP07 There's some really good enemy placement in this map. The mancubi, revenant, and cyberdemon placements in the beginning are very oppressive and require some quick thinking. Lots of pinkies throughout the map to apply pressure. You use a lot of verticality really well in this map. The cyberdemon really isn't justified though, you're not in that area long enough. If the cyberdemon could also see into the next room where you get the blue key, and continued to be a threat there, that would make it worth it. How are you supposed to kill him by the way? Usually with turreted cyberdemons it's best to provide a way to telefrag them or kill them with crushers. Also, unlike most monsters, cybers don't light up when they attack, so it's nice to make sure there's bright lights on them. I don't think any of the baron placements are justified either. Most times a hell knight will suffice, a baron should really only be used as a "door with health" or as a bulky thing to infight with cyberdemons. I got killed with about thirty monsters left and moved on even though I did like most of what I played.
MAP08 You can literally just run through this map in ten seconds, this map feels very out of place size-wise and difficulty-wise.
MAP09 Softlocked because there's a switch that can't be pressed. I'm not sure if the switch is broken or if I've been playing in the wrong complevel this whole time. There's a fence midtexture that should be set to impassable, you can just run through it.
Edit: Just now seeing that MAP09 isn't finished, maybe that's what happened Edit 2: I'm someone who would always prefer way too much criticism (even nitpicky criticism) rather than not enough criticism, so I take that approach when I offer feedback.
Last Edit: Dec 6, 2021 8:36:39 GMT -5 by lunchlunch
Post by mayhemicdestrvctor on Dec 6, 2021 13:45:16 GMT -5
thanks for playing all the maps and sorry i can 't watch the demo 's , i 'm still kinda new to doom and i don 't know how to play back demo files , sorry..
also i appreciate the effort to write all this down really much , and at the end you said you gave too much criticism but i don 't even think you did , i mean , at least if that 's true then i didn 't even notice.
i 've looked at all the things you said about my maps and i 've tried to fix or balance them out , added some ammo but also have placed different enemies in the fights you didn 't like to make em feel better , in map 6 i 've removed that archvile in the end and have added a bit more health to the entire map but did not touch the ammo of it.
in map 2 i 've replaced some enemies and took less enemies in total but took revenants cuz they are a very good threat in this room so it wouldn 't get too easy map 4 has more ammo now
the cyber demon in map 7 can teleport to that other room with the blue key , the thing is that killing the cyberdemon with a crusher is possible but it is just a secret just like how in doom 1 you can only kill some enemies if you find all secrets.
map 8 and 9 were not finished and i have made them at a different time then the first 7 maps and that 's probably why they feel pretty different but i agree that they are not as good because i have kind of been in a pretty bad place when i made them but i 'll probably scrap them unless i get another idea to finish them.#
i also wanted to tell you that this criticism you gave me is really use ful to me and made me learn some thing new about making maps. how i can use lightning to make certain obvious but also that hell knights by them selves are not that threatening and that i shouldn 't use that many barons , as well as not making that many boxy tech bases.
your criticism was really good and detailed too but also not like overdetailed and overwhelming while it 's a really nice read and it 's always clear what you mean. and i don 't know why you thought you were giving too much of it , but in any case i wanted to say you are doing a very good job and i want to encourage you to keep doing this in that way and if some one out there has not taken your criticism very well by feeling hurt from it or personally attacked for any reason then that isn 't not your fault , and when play testing some thing you should definitely continue to let your thoughts out like this , your criticism is some of the best and most helpful feed back i have received so far tbh.
The easiest way to play back demos is you download either PrBoom+ or DSDA DOOM, then you simply drag and drop your WAD, your DEH file, and the demo onto the shortcut. Just make sure to use the same version of the WAD that the demo was recorded with or it will desync. I'm glad the criticism is helpful and not overbearing.
Post by mayhemicdestrvctor on Dec 6, 2021 23:42:56 GMT -5
yeah that s a pretty good album but i prefer their black metal cd but i thought at war with satan is a cooler name for a wad , also how do i tag people Kontra Kommando
lunchlunch thanks the thing is i kinda hate prboom it never seems to really work properly on my pc , like i can play doom in it but the graphics are way too bright and it just seems really broken and glitchy in nature , and i prefer crispy doom when i 'm having some vanilla port but im gonna try it now thanks
just a little edit : in case you were still wondering if i know how to tag people i have found out now so yeah
Post by mayhemicdestrvctor on Dec 11, 2021 2:08:45 GMT -5
alright here 's a little update i made
so map 8 and 9 , which have been a point of criticism since they were so unfinished have been extended greatly. so i 'm posting this in case some one is interested in re- playing the wad , and for every one who already played the old version i will say that they should probably try it again since i have also fixed a lot of issues that lunchlunch has pointed out so yeah i 'd say it 's worth a replay especially if you didn 't enjoy the ammo shortage
Here are some demos I recorded while playing your maps.
MAP01: Pretty cool map. The fiery brimstone of it reminded me of John Romero's SIGIL. I think it would make more sense to give the berserk first and then have the health bonuses follow it (so I dont have to go behind them to get >100% health) I think the exit should be marked with an exit sign as well. Good opener!
MAP02: Plays nicely! I'm really liking the lighting here. Shotgun guys in the second area caught me by surprise. There are some ceilings that say no texture on them. Are they supposed to be sky ceilings? The ceiling flat should be F_SKY if its supposed to be sky. I liked it!
MAP03: In the final area, it looks like all the monsters were already alerted before I even entered it. I had a really close call, not sure how that mancubus didn't melt me at point blank. That was nice of him to let me run. I'm beginning to notice a common thing in your usage of sector lighting effects like effect 17 (light flickers.) When you have multiple sectors all using the same light source, each sector will blink at different intervals. This is a hardcoded vanilla doom engine thing, theres really no way around it. Using that sector lighting effect will only really look good if the light being emitted is made up of a single sector, (except for sector effects 8, 12, and 13, they are synchronized) Also noticed some "no texture" ceilings here too.
MAP04: Whoa this is a big jump in difficulty! Is it presumed that I would be carrying the gear I had from the previous levels? I did manage to make it through with 100% kills but i was very tight on ammo most of the time and had to take some risks to get basic essentials. I liked that the crushing ceiling was large enough that I could see it without having to look up, though I would recommend including maybe a new weapon or a powerup of some sort to telegraph it a little better. I think the starting room could use some health items and maybe a shotgun or chaingun to start with, and a little extra ammo in the beginning IMO.
MAP05: I liked this map a lot! It was a lot of fun. I presume the shotgun in brutal doom has a little more oomph in it though? The hell knights and revenants in the start area were tough with just a regular shotgun. There's a bug in the final room, as you walk up the steps towards the rocket launcher, the linedef trigger activates a lift that is tagged to 0. This will operate every sector in the map in vanilla source ports. If you've been testing in GZDoom then you wouldn't have caught it, but that linedef should be tagged to some non-zero number.
MAP06: Another good map. As these maps are ramping up in difficulty, I'm finding the weapons I need to be coming a little later than when I really could use them. I'm doing a lot of heavy lifting with the shotguns. I can see that you are new to mapping with the doom engine but you have good level design fundamentals and I'm happy to see that.
MAP07: Ammo is still a little tight. There's a lot of heavy monsters with high HP in this, so i grind up a lot of my ammunition taking them out. I exited without killing the cyberdemon because he was in a really difficult position and I think i would have used up all my ammo. I really like the exit area, though a simple walkover exit linedef would probably be better than the damaging floor exit effect one.
MAP08: I tried this one twice because I stepped in the exit early on. The exit needs to be marked with an exit sign. This is a pretty easy one if you know where the exit is. When you don't know, expecting the player to take out all these monsters with a berserk pack only before the radiation suit goes out is a tall order. I'd recommend putting in a secret weapon in here somewhere. On the other hand, when you do know where the exit is, you can pretty quickly and easily get through the whole thing without killing anyone and exit under 10 seconds. Theres an untextured wall on the lower lip where the lost soul monster closet lowers in. On the second run I tried to 100% it, and it is TOUGH. Very hard to do with only one radiation suit.
MAP09: The zombie men see you right from the start of the map. I personally prefer when maps don't start with monsters already seeing you before you do anything. I got stuck on this map and wasn't able to complete it. The switch doesn't look like it does anything when I press it. Perhaps its using a non-vanilla doom linedef action? Also the grate texture in front of the revenants is not marked impassable so you can run right through it.
Also oops I just realized I played the early version of the map and not the most recent one. Sorry!
Post by mayhemicdestrvctor on Dec 14, 2021 3:54:06 GMT -5
40oz thx for playing , and i have fixed some of the issues u said , and i still could fix them becuase somne of what you said was still present in the newest version of my wad so i did them but i also have to say that the ammo issues are not present any more in the newest version and also that the enemy placement was changed a little bit to feel less clunky at certain spots
and the newest version also has fixed map 9 and map 8 and in map 7 the cyberdemon can teleport in the room with the blue key , and because u have generally more rockets and stuff , you can use all the rockets to kill them and after all rockets are empty you can ssg kill him. that 's what i do , but if you don 't like to do that you can find the secret switch that will crush him , but you have to do that before thje cyberdemon teleports in the blue key room
and yes you can carry your stuff from playing previous levels , you don 't have to pistol start every level , you can try to do it but it 's not you 're forced to do it. every level in doom is balanced around pistol starts always and that 's what i did to , the element of carrying stuff from previous levels if you don 't die is a nice reward
the newest version also has added map 10 and started map 11 but i want map 11 to be a reference to the o of destuction , i want it to start out as a circle but i 'm not sure yet how to do it , i guess the ideas are like always going to emerge in my head as i place enemies
here is a link to the newest version with all the newest updates!!