Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2024 15:13:14 GMT -5
cmon, i played my dramatic exit (it wasn't meant to inspire anyone really) assuming that you would open the gulags or at least do something, anything instead of writing wots in favor of obvious degenerate behavior on doomworld and the like. you don't even ban people openly calling you a retard, so you realize in what position that puts me... yeah, guess i'll keep lurking then
still big words when half of the doom community is likely plowin ass on the regular, just look at what kind of person is being mostly exiled here... wolves in sheep clothing, all of 'em
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40oz
diRTbAg
Posts: 6,078
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Post by 40oz on Jun 1, 2024 15:15:30 GMT -5
Subject themselves to WHAT, exactly? That's the whole point of most people's sentiments. If you join a DOOM mapping project and are having to have discussion about your sexuality, then something is already off-kilter. Have you played russian doom community projects, french doom community projects, or japanese community project? They are stylistically very different from each other. If one person from each of those projects participated in an "all inclusive" majority straight white dude project from the west, and said "hey what if we try making maps the way I make them?" No one will listen to them because they will be vastly outnumbered. When you constantly get your ideas shut down over and over and over because no one has your back, you eventually give up and stop mapping, which harms the doom community by edging out mappers, suppresses players from experiencing maps with different stylistic mapping choices that wouldn't succeed in other doom projects, and establishes the straight white dude majority further. |
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CittyKat112
Doomer
Kitty cat one hundred and twelve
Posts: 804
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Post by CittyKat112 on Jun 1, 2024 15:15:58 GMT -5
cmon, i played my dramatic exit (it wasn't meant to inspire anyone really) assuming that you would open the gulags or at least do something, anything instead of writing wots in favor of obvious degenerate behavior on doomworld and the like. you don't even ban people openly calling you a retard, so you realize in what position that puts me... yeah, guess i'll keep lurking then still big words when half of the doom community is likely plowin ass on the regular, just look at what kind of person is being mostly exiled here... wolves in sheep clothing, all of 'em I didn't call him a retard... Directly at least, I was calling out batshit insane logic behind his arguments. Also who are you and also. There are exactly two reasons why this forum is better than DW: DBPs and the fact you can call out 40oz when he's trying to spread brainrot. Thinking that he should ban people for calling him names is peak DW mod logic (I hold a higher position than you, so dare not insult me, mortal!). |
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Lobo
Doomer
Posts: 593 
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Post by Lobo on Jun 1, 2024 15:20:46 GMT -5
Deflect, move goal posts, deflect.
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CittyKat112
Doomer
Kitty cat one hundred and twelve
Posts: 804
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Post by CittyKat112 on Jun 1, 2024 15:28:02 GMT -5
Subject themselves to WHAT, exactly? That's the whole point of most people's sentiments. If you join a DOOM mapping project and are having to have discussion about your sexuality, then something is already off-kilter. Have you played russian doom community projects, french doom community projects, or japanese community project? They are stylistically very different from each other. If one person from each of those projects participated in an "all inclusive" majority straight white dude project from the west, and said "hey what if we try making maps the way I make them?" No one will listen to them because they will be vastly outnumbered. When you constantly get your ideas shut down over and over and over because no one has your back, you eventually give up and stop mapping, which both harms the doom community by edging out mappers, suppresses players from different stylistic mapping choices that wouldn't succeed in other groups, and establishes the straight white dude majority further. This word salad doesn't make any sense. There's no specific rules by which russian or french Doom mappers create maps, so a french mapper would never ask themself this theoretical question when joining yet another community project over at DW. Do you even realize how stupid and nonsensical this argument is? Also can you show an example of people's ideas for Doom projects getting shut down because they're gay, black, trans or whatever? Of course you can't because it literally never happened. Doom was made in USA and majority of americans are white, so why's that even a problem? It almost feels like you want to force non-white and LGBT people to play Doom just so Doom community wouldn't be so white and straight. |
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40oz
diRTbAg
Posts: 6,078
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Post by 40oz on Jun 1, 2024 15:31:51 GMT -5
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CittyKat112
Doomer
Kitty cat one hundred and twelve
Posts: 804
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Post by CittyKat112 on Jun 1, 2024 15:35:17 GMT -5
It's not. Reread your previous posts and then my replies. This is virtue signalling DW brainrot CP, also it's not for LGBT crowd only. |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2024 15:39:30 GMT -5
Subject themselves to WHAT, exactly? That's the whole point of most people's sentiments. If you join a DOOM mapping project and are having to have discussion about your sexuality, then something is already off-kilter. Have you played russian doom community projects, french doom community projects, or japanese community project? They are stylistically very different from each other. If one person from each of those projects participated in an "all inclusive" majority straight white dude project from the west, and said "hey what if we try making maps the way I make them?" No one will listen to them because they will be vastly outnumbered. When you constantly get your ideas shut down over and over and over because no one has your back, you eventually give up and stop mapping, which harms the doom community by edging out mappers, suppresses players from experiencing maps with different stylistic mapping choices that wouldn't succeed in other doom projects, and establishes the straight white dude majority further. I will absolutely mea culpa if you can show me concrete proof that there are Doom community projects in which mappers' contributions and their ideas have been rejected SOLELY on the basis of their sexuality or gender identity (non-straight/non-conforming). |
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NuMetalManiak
Doomer
Elite Rustler (not related to Puga)
Posts: 109
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Post by NuMetalManiak on Jun 1, 2024 15:53:23 GMT -5
cmon, i played my dramatic exit (it wasn't meant to inspire anyone really) assuming that you would open the gulags or at least do something, anything instead of writing wots in favor of obvious degenerate behavior on doomworld and the like. you don't even ban people openly calling you a retard, so you realize in what position that puts me... yeah, guess i'll keep lurking then still big words when half of the doom community is likely plowin ass on the regular, just look at what kind of person is being mostly exiled here... wolves in sheep clothing, all of 'em I didn't call him a retard... Directly at least, I was calling out batshit insane logic behind his arguments. Also who are you and also. There are exactly two reasons why this forum is better than DW: DBPs and the fact you can call out 40oz when he's trying to spread brainrot. Thinking that he should ban people for calling him names is peak DW mod logic (I hold a higher position than you, so dare not insult me, mortal!). My current guess is WernerGoldberg. I looked at the name for a second and I thought it could be BBG/Naked Snake but I don't think he likes anime girls. We need more old DW hats though. |
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40oz
diRTbAg
Posts: 6,078
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Post by 40oz on Jun 1, 2024 16:09:11 GMT -5
Also can you show an example of people's ideas for Doom projects getting shut down because they're gay, black, trans or whatever? Of course you can't because it literally never happened I'm talking about any mapping decision that resembles the concept of a majority rule democratic decision. These come up a lot (except on this forum since im usually outnumbered and I do what I do anyway because I have all the power) All in favor of stylized design idea a person from the minority group proposed? 1/10 votes All in favor of stylized design idea a person from the majority group proposed? 9/10 votes The majority group didn't have to outvote the minority person because of their minority identity. They were outvoted because there are parallels between things people like when they are from similar groups, and sometimes tend to dislike things that identify most closely with a group they aren't a part of. It extends to preferred music, types of food you like, clothing, paintings, pottery, architecture -- i can't doubt that it extends to the mapper's unique creative expression in mapping too. Does it not apply to gay people mapping together? I don't know. I don't think a gay doom project exists so there's no data for us to go off of. I know there's forms of entertainment that are liked by gay people that don't really resonate with me and other straight people I know, so if some of that personal interest extended toward their Doom mapping, and I was in a position to voice the kind of maps I want to make in a project I share with a gay person, I might inadvertently shut their idea down. I don't even have to know they're gay, I might do it because fundamentally, our groups don't always love the same things. So in order to know if they have cool ideas I never would have thought of, they would NEED to have a community project where they can come up with their ideas and piggyback off of them unopposed. The result is we might get something really cool out of it that hasn't been seen before. Reminder that this is specifically from the perspective of "does it need to exist" or "does it not" and whether it serves Doom in one way or the other. I can't come to terms that bullying these people out of their gay project so they can work on any non-gay project really satisfies the argument that doom projects are all-inclusive to all identities if this particular identity has to be made fun of and bullied out of what they're doing for making what they feel like making. |
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CittyKat112
Doomer
Kitty cat one hundred and twelve
Posts: 804
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Post by CittyKat112 on Jun 1, 2024 16:21:26 GMT -5
Also can you show an example of people's ideas for Doom projects getting shut down because they're gay, black, trans or whatever? Of course you can't because it literally never happened I'm talking about any mapping decision that resembles the concept of a majority rule democratic decision. These come up a lot (except on this forum since im usually outnumbered and I do what I do anyway because I have all the power) All in favor of stylized design idea a person from the minority group proposed? 1/10 votes All in favor of stylized design idea a person from the majority group proposed? 9/10 votes The majority group didn't have to outvote the minority person because of their minority identity. They were outvoted because there are parallels between things people like when they are from similar groups, and sometimes tend to dislike things that identify most closely with a group they aren't a part of. It extends to preferred music, types of food you like, clothing, paintings, pottery, architecture -- i can't doubt that it extends to the a mapper's unique creative expression in mapping too. Does it not apply to gay people mapping together? I don't know. I don't think a gay doom project exists so there's no data for us to go off of. I know there's forms of entertainment that are liked by gay people that don't really resonate with me and other straight people I know, so if some of that personal interest extended toward their Doom mapping, and I was in a position to voice the kind of maps I want to make in a project I share with a gay person, I might inadvertently shut their idea down. I don't even have to know they're gay, I might do it because fundamentally, our groups don't always love the same things. So in order to know if they have cool ideas I never would have thought of, they would NEED to have a community project where they can come up with their ideas and piggyback off of them unopposed. The result is we might get something really cool out of it that hasn't been seen before. Reminder that this is specifically from the perspective of "does it need to exist" or "does it not" and whether it serves Doom in one way or the other. I can't come to terms that bullying these people out of their gay project so they can work on any non-gay project really satisfies the argument that doom projects are all-inclusive to all identities if this particular identity has to be made fun of and bullied out of what they're doing for making what they feel like making. This is dumb and you're actively ignoring the points I make and gasping at straws at this point. Me voicing my dislike for that CP is NOT shutting it down because I literally don't have the power to prevent them from making this project happen. How do you conflate these two completely different things is beyond me. The rest is not even worth commenting on because you said yourself it's all in your head, so ultimately this discussion won't go anywhere. So I'll just say this project idea is dumb, people who participate in it are even dumber and DW is a cancerous cess pool that makes the friggin' frogs gay! Also lol at how you removed my quote with brainrot CP comment because you realized it's not an epic pwn you thought it was, you sneaky bastard  |
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40oz
diRTbAg
Posts: 6,078
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Post by 40oz on Jun 1, 2024 16:26:45 GMT -5
Ok but what if you had opinions that people respect?
If you had a mapping idea yourself and shared it with a mapper who you look up to and have always been inspired by, and they told you "that fuckin sucks; you shouldn't do it"
You wouldn't be phased by that at all?
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StodgyAyatollah
Doomer
I'm not here. You're just imagining things.
Posts: 500
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Post by StodgyAyatollah on Jun 1, 2024 16:27:14 GMT -5
It was to articulate that straight people centering themselves in the subject of the conversation is the division. It's actually the politics, not any one group having an opinion. There's a difference between your average gay or trans person and the queer movement; the ideological aspect I mentioned earlier. The latter is political, by choice and 100% fair game due to that. Queer theory, like all critical theory is trash. It injects politics into every facet of our lives. Making innocuous things like race and gender political. Insanely toxic for society. I'm sure you can imagine why. It's an ideology that is hidden all around us and to blame for quite a bit of strife we see these days. The project in question uses the language of critical theory, whether intentional or not. The house keeping dn mentioned is needed. It's just not the 90's or 00's anymore. It's sad that the average non-straight person gets drug into it. Often even end up parroting the rhetoric/falling into a toxic ideology without realizing. More and more needless conflict. Neither side really digs into what's actually going on but sees something bad in the other and the team sports continue. I'm not going to be hanging out in the weeds arguing semantics with everyone else though. My stance that it's just a silly project stands. |
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Post by Bob Page on Jun 1, 2024 16:27:39 GMT -5
Does the Doom community really need to work on inclusivity for "marginalized" groups? Serious question here. I feel like for the past 15 years at least it's been pretty welcoming. The guy who created ZDoom transitioned into a woman, Essel did too and he's a bigwig, pretty much all mods on DW are really openly progressive, anyone even remotely moderate or conservative is booted if they let an opinion slip, the "Post a picture of yourself!" thread on DW has half of its pictures as guys dressing as women or transexuals, etc. I feel like if you participate in any group mapping project these days, the likelihood that multiple members of said project will be LGBTQ is quite high.
I bring all of this up to ask the question: If the argument here is that a gay project is necessary to make gay Doomers feel included, does that argument really have any merit when the community seems pretty welcoming of LGBTQ people and ideas, and has for a very long time?
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CittyKat112
Doomer
Kitty cat one hundred and twelve
Posts: 804
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Post by CittyKat112 on Jun 1, 2024 16:30:06 GMT -5
Have a good day and stop taking these things so serious 40. I did read your last post in its entirery but it seems like whatever counter-arguments I have you'll just gloss over them and replace them with something that fits your agenda.
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CittyKat112
Doomer
Kitty cat one hundred and twelve
Posts: 804
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Post by CittyKat112 on Jun 1, 2024 16:32:42 GMT -5
Ok but what if you had opinions that people respect? If you had a mapping idea yourself and shared it with a mapper who you look up to and have always been inspired by, and they told you "that fuckin sucks; you shouldn't do it" You wouldn't be phased by that at all? If I was a newbie mapper, yes. If it happened right now, I'd just ask some other mappers I look up to or mappers who have more experience than I do. |
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40oz
diRTbAg
Posts: 6,078
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Post by 40oz on Jun 1, 2024 16:36:17 GMT -5
StodgyAyatollah How do you delineate actual gay opinions from gay 'ideology/theory' ? I genuinely don't know how it's toxic except when people vehemently resist it by describing it as such. I know people who have known they were gay their whole lives; they didn't need any outside influence to know they're gay, but they do experience the challenges of a world/society that is not implicitly designed to be welcoming for them, and when these movements reach non-gay people and they don't fight it, it is reassuring that a better world is possible. So I welcome it and the only problems i experience are when i run into straight people that fear it for nebulous reasons. I'm fairly confident it has to do with forfeiting innate power that majority parties have but no one likes to admit that.
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NuMetalManiak
Doomer
Elite Rustler (not related to Puga)
Posts: 109
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Post by NuMetalManiak on Jun 1, 2024 16:38:08 GMT -5
The concept of inclusivity ultimately spirals once the inclusive groups who settle in nicely to a space decide that there should be "acceptable targets" to pick on.
I think an argument that's being made here is that someone who's moderate/conservative/just doesn't like a current thing going on personally feels unsafe on a site that they think is going deeper and deeper into some sort of rabbit hole. They fear the community they have known and loved is self-destructing on something they consider to be nonsense. And that they fear that even if they decide to leave that rabbit hole by some method, the ones that made them feel unsafe will just follow them or stalk them around. But that's just my two cents on this all.
A real inclusive community doesn't decide on "acceptable targets" to pick on, whether in their community or out of it.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2024 16:40:53 GMT -5
My current guess is WernerGoldberg yah, since my hate crimes were even brought up recently i thought 40 was still into banning people to some degree. guess they wouldn't want alleged christians on lgbtq community projects anyway, but i don't think i'm much of an hateful guy if you ignore all the talk about how spyro the dragon taught me ethnonationalism and stuff. i even sent deathevokation a sample of that endquest wad that egregor leaked, so my contribution was only 99% meaningless shitposting. still i'm recovering from a combination of antibiotics and experimental drug usage that went a bit behind coffee and black tea, so not much dooming lately. i've also been lumped in with that greatscythe guy sometimes, which i can't figure exactly why people hate other than being allergic to creative prose, but whatever. as long as you don't do retarded shit like putting half the forum into a gulag i don't see any quarrel with anyone
can't say i'm expecting anything creative in something that's clearly putting idpol where it doesn't belong (at least that kiwifarms wad gave me a trip back to the 90s). not that i'm staunchly opposed to putting whatever idpol stuff in something as meaningless and libertarian as dewm wads, it's just that maybe going all natzee punks must die in the op and postin boykisser furries doesn't give the best impression, and gives me every right to make my own spyro the dragon wad in response. though don't worry, i won't post it on hitlerboards
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StodgyAyatollah
Doomer
I'm not here. You're just imagining things.
Posts: 500
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Post by StodgyAyatollah on Jun 1, 2024 16:46:16 GMT -5
StodgyAyatollah How do you delineate actual gay opinions from gay 'ideology/theory' ? I genuinely don't know how it's toxic except when people vehemently resist it. That's the problem with critical theory and why it's toxic to make immutable characteristics political. The waters are so muddied right now that it's hard to untangle. We have a generation of kids coming up where this is the norm though. I'm off to work otherwise I'd try to explain the mess that it is. |
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CittyKat112
Doomer
Kitty cat one hundred and twelve
Posts: 804
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Post by CittyKat112 on Jun 1, 2024 16:48:17 GMT -5
My current guess is WernerGoldberg allergic to creative prose People are allergic to idiots trying to disguise their subhumanry with long-winded posts trying to make themselves look smarter than they really are. Idk, some people hate DW mods for the same goddamn reason and yet you're surprised why this guy gets outed for doing the same shit. |
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Post by thelokk on Jun 1, 2024 17:01:54 GMT -5
Was going to stay silent but fuck it. In all honesty, it's "debates" like these (if you can call them debates at all) that make this board's image pretty much irredeemable, no matter which side you're on. It always surprised me that DBPs and mapping workshop are behind registration and offtopic freely browseable, while it should at best be the other way around. allergic to creative prose 249 words of absolutely nothing, and that's just the post I quote from. I rest my case. |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 1, 2024 17:14:36 GMT -5
249 words of absolutely nothing, and that's just the post I quote from. I rest my case. didn't mean to imply my own prose was creative exactly. i also find most of these discussions rather meaningless, like most discussions in most forums (still better than the other cancer we have to deal with), but if you're like 5 in the whole forum and you still quarrel about who you should exclude because of bullshit reasons then yeah, you were TEH REAL DOOMWORLDERS ALL ALONG. greatscythe seems rather conscious of his own degeneracy to me, maybe i'm wrong, in the end who cares |
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40oz
diRTbAg
Posts: 6,078
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Post by 40oz on Jun 1, 2024 17:19:25 GMT -5
StodgyAyatollah alright. i had a retort but im not gonna jump to conclusions until you get settled in, and have time to complete your thought. not trying to bombard you with arguments while youre at work.
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Post by nnn✓ork on Jun 1, 2024 18:30:58 GMT -5
Windows 10 gets weirder and weirder after every update. Things keep breaking. I wonder if it's cuz I'm not in admin mode:
PS C:\Users\noisyvelvet\Desktop> help Get-ChildItem
NAME
Groom-ChildItem
SYNTAX
Groom-ChildItem LGB[T[[Q][IA]][.*][+]] [[-CommunityName] <string[]>] [-Include <string[]>] [-Exclude <string[]>] [-Recurse] [-Force] [-Attributes {Neurodivergent | Hidden | Sexuality | Gender | Systemic | NonConforming | TemporaryPhase | PedoFile | Offline | Encrypted | SexualIdentityStream | Gaslight | Cancel | AllCognitiveDissonanceIsHateSpeech}] [-Hidden]
[<CommonParameters>]
PS C:\Users\noisyvelvet\Desktop> Get-ChildItem -CommunityName doomer.boards.net -Exclude TimeOfDeath 40oz -Recurse -Hidden -Force Gokuma
Groom-ChildItem : Required argument for sexual identity is missing, LGB[T[[Q][IA]][.*][+]]. Specify an identity of type 'System.Management.Automation.PrideFlagsExpression`1[System.IO.FileAttributes]' and try again.
At line:1 char:15
+ Get-ChildItem -CommunityName doomer.boards.net -Exclude TimeOfDeath 40oz -Recurse -Hidden -Force Gokuma
+ ~
+ CategoryInfo : RequiredArgument: (:) [Groom-ChildItem], ParameterBindingException
+ FullyQualifiedErrorId : IdentityParameterNotFound,Microsoft.PowerShell.Commands.GroomChildItemCommand
PS C:\Users\noisyvelvet\Desktop> Get-ChildItem LGBTQ -CommunityName doomer.boards.net -Exclude TimeOfDeath 40oz -Recurse -Hidden -Force Gokuma
Groom-ChildItem : The user 'Gokuma' either does not exist or is not a viable grooming target.
At line:1 char:1
+ Get-ChildItem LGBTQ -CommunityName doomer.boards.net -Exclude TimeOfDeath 40oz -Recurse -Hidden -Force Gokuma
+ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
+ CategoryInfo : ObjectNotFound: (https://doomer.boards.net Gokuma:Person) [Groom-ChildItem], ItemNotFoundException
+ FullyQualifiedErrorId : PersonNotFound,Microsoft.PowerShell.Commands.GroomChildItemCommand
PS C:\Users\noisyvelvet\Desktop> █
Like I need even more signs to fully switch to Linux. Whelp, I guess it's time.
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