Pedophiles and death penalty

I am, as of late, against death penalty in general, no matter what the crime. I admit I have not always been against death penalty, and my position on this matter is not deeply entrenched, but there are arguments against it that do matter to me.

www.knowswhy.com/arguments-against-death-penalty/
In particular,
2. Death penalty is irreversible: the risk of killing innocent men is high
5. Death penalty is often perpetrated by corrupt governments, authorized by skewed judicial systems, and used as a political tool

Supporting death penalty even for one brand of criminals, in my view, paves the way for death penalty being used for punishing other crimes as well, so better to leave it prohibited for absolutely all criminal cases.

As for treatment for pedophiles, if the current "scientific" consensus is that sexual orientation is something one is born with, rather than what is established during socialization, it is probable pedophilia is innate behavior too. Chemical castration requires compliance (can be counteracted by injecting other drugs) and is reversible, so not all that reliable despite its already high level of intrusion into person's life. Some consider even voluntary chemical castration to be already inhumane.

On the other hand, I actually disagree with the view that sexual orientation is predetermined at birth, so I hope that pedophilia is treatable.

P.S. When I say "sexual orientation is predetermined at birth" it does NOT imply "sexual orientation is a matter of person's conscious choice". There are other options, not easy for me to explain, though.

Meaningful stats here are not going to happen; a society that goes in for physical mutilation of criminals tends not to be the sort of society that keeps accurate, open records.

As for sexual orientation being something you are born with, that's a gross oversimplification. Everyone is a product of their environment: we are formed and shaped as from clay, not shat out fully formed into a predeterministic universe. And pedophilia is not even equatable with sexual orientation - this habit of equating sexuality with dangerous, fetishistic pathologies  is the exact same shit that made people stone gays to begin with. It's a fucking medieval level understanding of psychology, and theories lumping "pedosexuality" alongside homosexuality will end up doing untold damage to legitimate LGB people as they find themselves folded into the same societal package as sexual predators, rapists, dog monglers and people with anime avatars.

Chomo is not a sexual orientation. It's a pathology that has activated in response to trauma, it revels in control over the powerless and inflicting irreparable damage against innocence. It's an aimless revenge fantasy, it's satisfaction gained through the ruination of trust and the ultimate betrayal.

Worse, it perpetrates itself. It is passed along through the generations of abused-cum-abuser like some fucked up original sin.

And that is where the efforts at rehabilitation *need* to be targeted - you want to sort out the molester problem, you get in at the ground floor, you try your damnedest to sort out the victims first and foremost. And that is a lifelong therapy - even people who have come to terms with what happened to them as children often find themselves freaking out when they themselves become parents. Empathy kicks in when they look at their own naked, defenseless child, and they find themselves aware of a terrible seed that was planted in them by a predator. Empathy with their child; a soul-destroying, gut-churning empathy with their own near-forgotten abuser, risen anew like fucking satan from hell's own mist.

It - like most matters of the human - is a fucking complex, near insoluble problem with no easy answer. Imperfect laws, imperect understanding, imperfect therapies and imperfect societies; the safest way forward is to empty the protected wings of prisons, plow the chomos into oiled pits and burn the disgusting fucks alive. Let a pillar of black smoke - five miles wide and rising ten miles high - go up into the heavens like a new tower of Babel. Let it be a visual, a warning, a celebration, a holocaust of the pedophiles.


I'm honestly fucking fine with that, for nothing of value was lost.

We're talking about abolishing death penalties, not offering pardons. It's pretty much impossible to find any studies that support that harsher sentences deter crime as far as I can tell. Search for yourself.

EDIT: rather, the thread is more about the social stigma of pedophilia being so revolting that groups of people justify responding to it with the most extreme penalties they can think of (death.) I think this influences voters to justify legal capital punishment when we really don't need it, and it doesn't fix the problem. The pedophiles still have to ACT in order for us to use it. I don't know what kind of treatment centers for this are available in the US. There may be effective ones, there may be severely underfunded ones, or none at all. I'm kinda hesitant to look it up lest I flag the FBI to keep an eye on me. But if they do exist and are largely unknown, I suspect they are not getting the support they need, and we're just leaning on potential pedophiles to kill themselves or self-isolate forever, which is a really weak way to address the problem and not congruent with people's feelings about it.

I think child molesters should either be executed or chemically castrated, with maximum imprisonment. While in prison, it is a good chance the life-sentenced inmates will actually kill the child molester.

The law has to do that, otherwise there will be rampant communal-vigilantism if people do not feel there is justice for their crimes. People will start going to mafias or gangs to seek justice.

In India, in sections with little-to-no rule of law, if a village catches a rapist, they all take turns sticking a knife in them. They sort of look like human pin-cushions.

imo a long-ass prison sentence (idk, 10+ years) is better than the death sentence for crimes like this, simply because that way the criminal goes through a similar thing as the victim. a rape victim is traumatised for a long time/for life and has to live with that stuff. that's why just shooting the guy and letting him die right then feels wrong to me, because that way he will never understand what he has done to his victim. Does that make any sense?
idk tho 🤷‍♂️🤷‍♀️ i'm not a lawmaker or a philosopher, i just shitpost on a forum with 50 members about how big my penis is.

Is it though? is the attraction to children something therapy can fix? I don't know.

It's not about reclaiming lost innocence, imho. Like most forms of rape, it's about a fantasy of power and control, magnified from either an innate position of powerlessness (i.e: your typical incel type) or as an extension of power from an existing position of authority (i.e: your friendly neighborhood priest, Epstein, or Tory magnate). Your standard bullshit delusions of godhood, in other words.

Pathologically, pedos are not impulsive - at least compared to, say, instances of OCD, or an arsonist who just burns shit in the spur of the moment - but the offender actively seeks out victims and opportunity. Indeed, to avoid consequences, he plans meticulously for months at a time. There is a malice of forethought and modus operandi here that moves this shit from the realm of untreated mental disorder into that of premeditated criminal enterprise: I'd argue that the seeking, planning, and manipulation of the victims provide more satisfaction to the perpetrator than the actual act itself.

For context, this phase would be roughly analogous to the "wooing" phase of a normal relationship between two adults. Let that comparison percolate inside your brain for a bit before deciding if these people are truly worthy of even a single molecule of sympathy. Or pity.

As for "fixing" offenders - sure, you can try shit. Psychic driving techniques only occasionally result in suicide, and we can teach rats to keep the fuck away from cheese by blasting them full of electricity whenever they start sniffing around the brie. Deballing the fuckers or pumping them full of hormone blockers does *not* remove the sex drive, it merely displaces it elsewhere, often into violence - consider the crimes of "impotent" serial killers who, when denied an outlet for their frustration, simply rip women apart to get their kicks. Castration in this instance works only in the sense of eugenics; it's probable that the reason for the upper 1% of society being so rancid with pedophiles is because the upper 1% are fucking amoral, Darwinian sociopaths - they have to possess that pathology in order to fuck everyone over on their way to the top and be able to sleep at night afterwards. Those heritable antisocial personality disorders, combined with greater opportunity and immunity from consequence, means a higher percentage of abusers move in the upper class. And those are the ones who can afford lawyers, even before you strap them into the proctologist's chair and come at their bollocks with a pair of secateurs.

I don't think you can meaningfully "help" these people once they have passed the brink; the smart ones revel in their self-aggrandizing psychosis and the dumb ones are so fucking retarded that they think they are the victims in all this. At best, we can lobotomize them into drooling, perpetually masturbating and societally worthless meatsacks. It might be kinder to avoid such half-measures: life isn't sacred, and death is the ultimate hygiene of civilization. I'd take that as the price paid for living in a world that doesn't make me want to vomit.

To clarify: in my message above I wasn't putting pedophilia in the same moral category as homosexuality or vice versa. If that's what started this train of thought about people putting them too close, I didn't intend it. I know next to nothing about pedophilia and in that paragraph I was merely speculating about whether it could be innate or obtained, and thus what could be our chances of treating it. The speculation also was not due to some theories read that lump the two together.

As for "life isn't sacred, and death is the ultimate hygiene of civilization" - I would agree, but I don't trust government to do the right judgement, and would rather not give them an authority to execute any people. They have enough opportunity to do this shit already (through wars). When nature sets out to kill people, for example, through COVID-19, it is a good thing and an example of natural selection, indeed. To add to that COVID-19 also resulted in many eye-opening events, such as exposure of various national leaders for what they really are. But it is not for humans to play gods.

The governments only really encourage people having children and the like because the economics model is built on the perpetually expanding population. They don't have any moral or altruistic motives in this - for them it is investment, that make them richer. So if they seem to want to deal with the issue pedophilia by promoting death penalty, what they really want is death penalty being promoted, or some other thing that benefits them, the 1% in power. The government never does anything for the community unless it benefits it in some way.

Giving them the authority to kill is thus a huge fucking mistake.

What you say here doesn't make much sense. Sexual attractions are not stabilized until post-puberty. Children typically go through phases of sexual games (like the "doctor-patient" games at a young age), with members of their own as well as the opposite sex, but it is not predictive as to where they will find themselves on the homo-heterosexual spectrum as adults, or whether they will develop any kind of sexual fetishes/pathologies etc.

There is no data that suggests that pedophilia is "most often" a product of trauma.

In fact, it turns out that science classifies pedophilia different from the behavior of child molestation. Not all people with pedophiliac tendencies end up molesting children, and what was more interesting for me to discover - not every child molester is automatically classified as a pedophile.

Thus the topic of this thread, as I understand it, is more specifically about child molesters, not pedophiles.

Since some people are inherently bisexual, there must be an element of choice present if/when such people decide to find long-term partners.

I think science can tell (and has told) us a great deal. It is just that the violent parts of the LGBT movement apply strong bullying and silencing techniques, for their own political reasons, so that certain topics become taboo not only to discuss/advocate for, but even to do scientific research on.

lol why are people writing walls of pseudo intellectual text over this? pedophiles' only contribution to society is breaking people, sexually confusing them at a young age, damaging their ability to trust.. at the very least they shouldn't see the world outside of the prison cell lest they do it again.

Those people have a moral obligation to get chemically castrated than.

Unfortunately, this treatment requires compliance and can be counteracted by injecting testosterone. Worse yet, an individual that was initially compliant may recognise that absense of any sexual drive has a profound impact on their life, which may make them seek out testosterone injection for relief, only to find out that the urge returns and is more difficult to control than before (when testosterone is reintroduced after a long period of suppression, it may cause psychosis, acts of uncontrollable violence, and the like). It may actually cause the person to become an actual offender for the first time, or make them get in trouble for something else.

I think if someone recognizes they have an issue, than it is their moral obligation to be chemically castrated, and to stay that way. If they don't and never act on their urges, no one will ever know. I am sure people fantasies about all kinds of disgusting shit. But if they do act, than I think execution is fitting. Therefore, I think death penalty should apply to pedophiles, or chemical castration with maximum penalty in prison.