BIG DICK NIGGA
this post is a lie about my bodily proportions
Major Arlene obsessed, 100% verified freakazoid. AKA bzzrak
Posts: 2,296
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Post by BIG DICK NIGGA on Jan 19, 2023 18:58:01 GMT -5
How the h*ck do you even respond to this phrase? It drives me absolutely bonkers whenever I hear it, but I can't even begin to articulate why, let alone think of a comeback. Why does it annoy me so much? Really, why can't we all just let people enjoy things? Even if those things are retarded, and the people are retarded as well? There's got to be a good reason as to why we even care what other people are doing. I mean seriously. If I met a guy who enjoys eating his own excrement, I'd yell at him and call him a retard, or a fagot, or even a Doomworld moderator. But why? Why can't I just let him consume his own shit in peace? Why do I even care? I'm not the one eating shit. He'll probably get hepatitis, as you generally do from eating excrement, but that's not my problem either. Well, technically I am paying for his hospital trip with my taxes, but I'm paying for lots of shit with my taxes. My country's president has his own illegal weed farms. I wish that was a joke or an exaggeration. I doubt he's funding that shit from his pocket. So the shit-eater from my story has my preference with regards to spending my tax money. To be absolutely technical, I'm not paying any taxes at all yet, but let's pretend for the sake of the argument that I'm a functional adult, and not a Doomer Boards member of six years.
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dn
Body Count: 02
the motherfucking darknation
Posts: 1,728
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Post by dn on Jan 20, 2023 3:37:56 GMT -5
Learn to enjoy schadenfreude. God must love it too, otherwise he wouldn't have made and populated the world with so many fucking retards.
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CittyKat112
Doomer
Kitty cat one hundred and twelve
Posts: 640
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Post by CittyKat112 on Jan 20, 2023 5:06:57 GMT -5
I can't take anyone who says this shit seriously after I learned about bug chasers (gay men who deliberately have sex with people who have AIDS and other STDs to get sick themselves). This world is fucked.
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40oz
diRTbAg
Posts: 5,536
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Post by 40oz on Jan 20, 2023 17:18:07 GMT -5
I'm in the "let people enjoy things" camp for most stuff I haven't tried or generally have little interest in. It gets a little weird when "let people enjoy things" becomes "you’re not allowed to not enjoy things" in subjects I'm heavily invested in. It's really annoying to see commentary about Doom related stuff that is not very accurate to what I'm about to play because positive outlooks on Doom are loved and negative people are bullies.
Doom Eternal gets a lot of protection from it's "git gud" chanting fanbase even though it's a game that almost plays itself.
Amateur slaughtermaps get elevated by slaughter 'fans' that flex about enjoying maps that most people won't bother to play. Pretty sure half of these people don't even play the maps they are congratulating on release.
And abstract/avant-garde maps that are genuinely bad, ugly, and play poorly but they are made by someone who is shy and mysterious and writes all in lower-case, one-sentence posts like twice a year seem to get a lot of misplaced love as well.
It would be nice to read some comments that say this shit sucks once in a while so that I don't feel misled all the time. Sometimes I'm busy all month and can't wait to play the cool new doom wads that come out that everyone is talking about, and then when I finally do, I get bored or frustrated 15 minutes into it. The opposition criticism is so strong these days.
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BIG DICK NIGGA
this post is a lie about my bodily proportions
Major Arlene obsessed, 100% verified freakazoid. AKA bzzrak
Posts: 2,296
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Post by BIG DICK NIGGA on Jan 20, 2023 18:09:56 GMT -5
someone who is shy and mysterious and writes all in lower-case, one-sentence posts like twice a yea Just say yakfak. Lol when "let people enjoy things" becomes "you’re not allowed to not enjoy things" That's a good point. That might be at least partly why that phrase annoys me.
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nnnvork
Doomer
Nom-nom Chomsky
Posts: 542
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Post by nnnvork on Jan 20, 2023 18:44:28 GMT -5
I just don't like it when the "you're allowed to not like things" overextends and becomes "you are not allowed to like things"; the vice versa of what we have here. In terms of Doom, we've all seen people double down on critical comments on a map or thread they don't like instead of just moving on when not everyone seems to agree with them. And sometimes the sentiment of "you only like this thing so you can be polite or a hipster" isn't always the case either. This reminds me of a good comment I read a few months back on Doomworld. As far as handling the general reality of "not everyone likes the same thing" and how to embed yourself uniquely Doom Map-osphere, here's a good write up by RonnieJamesDiner on Doomworld: www.doomworld.com/forum/post/2540465 - Some really great advice and commentary if you ask me. That's it from me, now excuse me. It's a weekend and time to unwind. I've been unthawing them from the freezer all day and have a pile of feces to dig into.
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shibainumaster
Doomer
Kombucha Mushroom person (sits around all day)
Posts: 420
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Post by shibainumaster on Feb 7, 2023 9:34:38 GMT -5
I'm in the "let people enjoy things" camp for most stuff I haven't tried or generally have little interest in. It gets a little weird when "let people enjoy things" becomes "you’re not allowed to not enjoy things" in subjects I'm heavily invested in. It's really annoying to see commentary about Doom related stuff that is not very accurate to what I'm about to play because positive outlooks on Doom are loved and negative people are bullies. Doom Eternal gets a lot of protection from it's "git gud" chanting fanbase even though it's a game that almost plays itself. Amateur slaughtermaps get elevated by slaughter 'fans' that flex about enjoying maps that most people won't bother to play. Pretty sure half of these people don't even play the maps they are congratulating on release. And abstract/avant-garde maps that are genuinely bad, ugly, and play poorly but they are made by someone who is shy and mysterious and writes all in lower-case, one-sentence posts like twice a year seem to get a lot of misplaced love as well. It would be nice to read some comments that say this shit sucks once in a while so that I don't feel misled all the time. Sometimes I'm busy all month and can't wait to play the cool new doom wads that come out that everyone is talking about, and then when I finally do, I get bored or frustrated 15 minutes into it. The opposition criticism is so strong these days. I personally tried criticising maps that were overpraised at some point, in my case authors largely implied they were inspired by Sandy Peterson and some fabled "Design principles of older mappers". "Doom Refired" it was called i believe:https://www.doomworld.com/forum/topic/128420-doom-refired-e1-demo-out-d2-vanilla-project/ My main gripe was the inconsistency with custom texture quality and map quality, mainly that the maps we're structured poorly, but the textures were actually creative (I said:"How do you people make amazing textures and then use them in the worst maps?"). Doom ZERO can also be lumped in this category, come, play 10000000 maps with the same floor lowering\raising puzzles, Messy texturing, and a lazy retcon of the Doom (2016)'s story. Slaughter maps were recently burdened with the creations of Baja blast rd., Example:https://www.doomworld.com/forum/topic/131402-sally-boom-map/?tab=comments#comment-2545690 My friend sent me this map, giving it the monocher of "Autistic slaughter map". This map has problems with resurce balance, The titular "Sally" is a barely recognasible tapeworm with square midtex wings. All these might just be minor nitpicks, but it's surprising how literally no-one seriously gives criticism, the most is:"Oh i saw a horrid visual bug here, but otherwise the map is completely flawless whatsoever, loving the sector dragon)))). P.S Make more!" Worst thing is that jannies will eventually try to block out any user criticising someone\something the populus likes, no matter how much of a bad actor the person in question is or isn't. Even if it's rational criticism.
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BIG DICK NIGGA
this post is a lie about my bodily proportions
Major Arlene obsessed, 100% verified freakazoid. AKA bzzrak
Posts: 2,296
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Post by BIG DICK NIGGA on Apr 2, 2023 12:38:41 GMT -5
Le bump! thebaffler.com/latest/dont-let-people-enjoy-things-wagnerI stumbled upon this article and I think it's a good deconstruction of the subtext behind the phrase. Essentially when people say "let people enjoy things" they mean one or more of four things: 1) "I take criticism of my favourite content as a personal attack on myself"; 2) "Lol STFU"; 3) "ok, and? so what?"; 4) "oh no your criticism actually sparked a thought in my head". The one that vexes me the most is probably #4. If you like something that most people don't, either be prepared to be judged for it and to have to defend yourself, OR hide it from everyone really well, no middle option. In the future I will adopt the things said in this article and pretend I came up with them.
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Post by rickwinger on Apr 4, 2023 13:31:40 GMT -5
I'm in the "let people enjoy things" camp for most stuff I haven't tried or generally have little interest in. It gets a little weird when "let people enjoy things" becomes "you’re not allowed to not enjoy things" in subjects I'm heavily invested in. It's really annoying to see commentary about Doom related stuff that is not very accurate to what I'm about to play because positive outlooks on Doom are loved and negative people are bullies. ... Amateur slaughtermaps get elevated by slaughter 'fans' that flex about enjoying maps that most people won't bother to play. Pretty sure half of these people don't even play the maps they are congratulating on release. ... It would be nice to read some comments that say this shit sucks once in a while so that I don't feel misled all the time. Sometimes I'm busy all month and can't wait to play the cool new doom wads that come out that everyone is talking about, and then when I finally do, I get bored or frustrated 15 minutes into it. The opposition criticism is so strong these days. Thank you for posting this.
What the fuck is this, "limitations breed creativity," fucking bullshit? Are DOOM mappers no better than prisoners, who get praised for the same thing when they manage to cook a ramen noodle spread without hot water?
The year is 2023 and if I see one more map made with stock DOOM2 textures, I'm going to shit on my face and call it art, wondering why people aren't praising me for my masochistic ingenuity.
This is also how I feel about "slaughter-style" wads, in general. How many fucking games are out there, but you want me to play your shitty fucking map 30 times in order to memorize the atrociously brain-dead combat strategy?
Then somebody makes a thread asking why some people don't like "slaughter-style" maps. Would you believe me if I told you that many people wrote entire essays in that thread rebutting all the requested negative opinions as "uninformed and wrong"? That's what I get for replying to a thread with a yiffer avatar. I should've fucking read the room.
Anyways, I'm glad there's a single vestige of critical thinking inside this subset of a gaming community which I know and love. I really love making DOOM maps and making games and mods in general. I just don't have the patience to replay the same damn map over and over again just to beat it once. That's how games were made before anybody gave a shit, like on the Nintendo, where game making companies deliberately produced shit just because their budgets were low and they knew those dumbfuck kids wouldn't question it, nor have the place to do so. In this day and age of the internet, it's amazing to see dissenting opinions get stifled, but that's MARKETING for you--
--and who knew a zombified game from 1993 needed SO MUCH MARKETING.
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skyr
Doomer
Still looking for the missing chromosomes
Posts: 245
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Post by skyr on Apr 4, 2023 14:43:41 GMT -5
but you want me to play your shitty fucking map 30 times in order to memorize the atrociously brain-dead combat strategy? git gud
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BIG DICK NIGGA
this post is a lie about my bodily proportions
Major Arlene obsessed, 100% verified freakazoid. AKA bzzrak
Posts: 2,296
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Post by BIG DICK NIGGA on Apr 4, 2023 15:16:16 GMT -5
The year is 2023 and if I see one more map made with stock DOOM2 textures, I'm going to shit on my face and call it art, wondering why people aren't praising me for my masochistic ingenuity. 2023?????? THE CURRENT YEAR??????? AND THIS NEW MAPSET DOESN'T HAVE FIFTY MEGABYTES OF SHITTY TEXTURES SHITTILY RIPPED FROM OTHER RETRO VIDEO GAMES AND SHITTY RECOLOURS AND EDITS OF ORIGINAL DOOM TEXTURES??????? AAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!! I LITERALLY CANNOT PLAY THIS!!!!!!! If limitations didn't breed creativity, the Doom community would've died by 1999. None of us would be here. On Zoomer Boards I mean. Or maybe in this world too. I have no way of verifying the world existed before the release of Doom.
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CittyKat112
Doomer
Kitty cat one hundred and twelve
Posts: 640
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Post by CittyKat112 on Apr 4, 2023 15:21:37 GMT -5
The year is 2023 and if I see one more map made with stock DOOM2 textures, I'm going to shit on my face and call it art, wondering why people aren't praising me for my masochistic ingenuity.
Play The 10x10 Project dude.
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Post by rickwinger on Apr 4, 2023 17:20:54 GMT -5
This is the general consensus. If limitations didn't breed creativity, the Doom community would've died by 1999. None of us would be here. On Zoomer Boards I mean. Or maybe in this world too. I have no way of verifying the world existed before the release of Doom. If limitations really bred creativity, why is every DOOM map played on a sourceport and not the original 1.9 engine from '95? If limitations bred creativity, there would be no innovation. Play The 10x10 Project dude. Yeah, I was a bit heavy-handed with my remarks. I gotta try to look at some of these WADs and maps with a different outlook. To be fair, I'm not very well-versed in DOOM community projects. I am familiar with some of the older hits, like Alien Vendetta, and I quite enjoy Eviternity, but some of these "my first WAD" projects that I try-out elsewhere are just pure hot shit that somehow get met with either unanimous praise, lukewarm criticism, or complete silence. Also to be fair, I am new to this community and the DOOM community as a whole, so take my uninformed opinion for what it is. I am perpetually ready to eat my words. The 10x10 Project looks neat and I'll have to play it before I revise my opinion on limitations. I still see it as an arbitrary challenge that amounts to little more than masturbation, when considering the value of the work to someone other than a mapper or modder. And that's also probably where I'm misunderstanding things: I think DOOM should be loved by the whole world, not just a small subset of greasy fucks who think that good gameplay revolves around trial and error or making something within strict limitations is good for anyone except for the creator themselves.
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BIG DICK NIGGA
this post is a lie about my bodily proportions
Major Arlene obsessed, 100% verified freakazoid. AKA bzzrak
Posts: 2,296
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Post by BIG DICK NIGGA on Apr 4, 2023 17:39:55 GMT -5
If limitations really bred creativity, why is every DOOM map played on a sourceport and not the original 1.9 engine from '95? The original doom.exe isn't used anymore simply because you can't run it on a modern PC. That's it, that's the reason. Not because of limitations or MUH FEATURES or something silly like that. The existence and popularity of Chocolate Doom makes this very obvious. 20 years ago when you could still run doom.exe on a Windows PC, people did use it. Also, maps that can run in the vanilla engine still come out regularly. See www.gamers.org/pub/games/idgames/LAST.60daysSource port cucks left seething again.
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Post by lunchlunch on Apr 4, 2023 17:57:38 GMT -5
That phrase is only used by people that get overly defensive about their pedestrian taste. For those complaining about slaughter maps, I want to unironically tell you to git gud. But this only applies to well balanced slaughter maps. The truth is, I don't like the majority of slaughter maps either. If your idea of slaughter is to place a thousand enemies in a flat boxy room with no thought put into verticality or level geometry, I don't like your map. If you have to know the exact placement of all item pickups and the exact timing of enemies spawning in specific places, I don't like your map. There is a huge difference between something being possible,and even then only with a single exact strategy, and something being fair.rickwinger Thinking that a map sucks or is pretentious for simply using the textures that came with the game is an absurd take. Play something like Brigandine or Counter Attack to be blown away by what's possible with stock assets. Better yet, I encourage you to try to make a good looking non-generic map using stock textures and you'll have a profound respect for the craftsmanship that goes into making one of those levels.
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Philomena
I'm too young to die
Never trust an anime avatar
Posts: 8
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Post by Philomena on Apr 4, 2023 18:50:43 GMT -5
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Post by rickwinger on Apr 4, 2023 20:41:55 GMT -5
Thinking that a map sucks or is pretentious for simply using the textures that came with the game is an absurd take. Play something like Brigandine or Counter Attack to be blown away by what's possible with stock assets. Better yet, I encourage you to try to make a good looking non-generic map using stock textures and you'll have a profound respect for the craftsmanship that goes into making one of those levels. Okay, fine. Challenge accepted. I have yet to do such a thing, so until I do or try, I won't have the right to talk so much shit about it. Fair. I'll get back to you afterwards. I bet I will have learned something and maybe that's the point of some maps. Not everything has to be a playable release or a complete product, I suppose. It's the quality-of-life that really matters to me. OTEX and UDMF in Ultimate Doom Builder are very easy to use and have a wide variety of powerful features that make editing a breeze. I can implement all sorts of wacky shit into my games quickly and easily via ACS or usually just with a linedef action. Maybe the point I'm missing is all that wacky shit != a good game. The original doom.exe isn't used anymore simply because you can't run it on a modern PC. That's it, that's the reason. Not because of limitations or MUH FEATURES or something silly like that. The existence and popularity of Chocolate Doom makes this very obvious. 20 years ago when you could still run doom.exe on a Windows PC, people did use it. Ah, Chocolate Doom: the sourceport that deliberately introduces limitations and keeps those game-crashing bugs right where they always were. Now that's what I call quality entertainment. The PrBoom+ port gets some of my respect for at least removing some of the more arbitrary limitations. It's got the best performance out of all of the modern sourceports that I know of. That's it. It's like 1995, but runs smooth and doesn't break! Perfect illusion of greatness. I know vanilla maps are made every day. They are also universally-praised in certain subsets of the DOOM community. That doesn't make them good. Most of them are god-fucking-awful, just like sooo many maps made in the 90's. Limitations bred creative ways to make total dogshit, that's for sure, and still does today. I can't say all maps made within vanilla-esque limitations are bad, but lots of them are, especially the ones made today. And for no good reason, when there are so many tools out there to easily add even one single bit of uniqueness or ingenuity that wasn't seen in the original games. But I might be misunderstanding a lot of personal taste here. I keep thinking that uniqueness and ingenuity can only happen when new assets or features are added. I will have to get back here when I am done with lunchlunch's challenge. >I am perpetually ready to eat my words. Okay fuck-o, that was funny. Now I know why you didn't add any of your own words to that reply.
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BIG DICK NIGGA
this post is a lie about my bodily proportions
Major Arlene obsessed, 100% verified freakazoid. AKA bzzrak
Posts: 2,296
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Post by BIG DICK NIGGA on Apr 5, 2023 4:19:08 GMT -5
Ah, Chocolate Doom: the sourceport that deliberately introduces limitations and keeps those game-crashing bugs right where they always were. Now that's what I call quality entertainment. Yes because all of those limitations and bugs are part of the game Doom. PrBoom+ isn't Doom, just its soymaxxed brother. Maps for PrBoom+ aren't Doom maps because the game Doom doesn't support them.
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CittyKat112
Doomer
Kitty cat one hundred and twelve
Posts: 640
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Post by CittyKat112 on Apr 5, 2023 6:00:48 GMT -5
Иди нахуй анимепидорское чмо.
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CittyKat112
Doomer
Kitty cat one hundred and twelve
Posts: 640
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Post by CittyKat112 on Apr 5, 2023 6:10:46 GMT -5
Ah, Chocolate Doom: the sourceport that deliberately introduces limitations and keeps those game-crashing bugs right where they always were. Now that's what I call quality entertainment. Yes because all of those limitations and bugs are part of the game Doom. PrBoom+ isn't Doom, just its soymaxxed brother. Maps for PrBoom+ aren't Doom maps because the game Doom doesn't support them. Vanilla Doom sucks, fuck you. Boom/Limit-removing maps are Doom maps, no matter the format. And nobody would give a fuck about Doom mapping and modding if all we'd be getting was cringe vanilla mapsets and no mods (because by your retarded logic mods aren't Doom cuz you can only run them in GZDoom). If you're a deranged coprophile that doesn't mean everyone else should consoom faeces just like you do.
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Philomena
I'm too young to die
Never trust an anime avatar
Posts: 8
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Post by Philomena on Apr 5, 2023 8:25:40 GMT -5
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shibainumaster
Doomer
Kombucha Mushroom person (sits around all day)
Posts: 420
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Post by shibainumaster on Apr 5, 2023 9:28:56 GMT -5
Hitler gassed jews y'know, should've just let him enjoy things, it's just a hobby.
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BIG DICK NIGGA
this post is a lie about my bodily proportions
Major Arlene obsessed, 100% verified freakazoid. AKA bzzrak
Posts: 2,296
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Post by BIG DICK NIGGA on Apr 5, 2023 9:45:57 GMT -5
Vanilla Doom sucks, fuck you. Boom/Limit-removing maps are Doom maps, Deep down you know that isn't true. Doom is Doom. Go cope somewhere else
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CittyKat112
Doomer
Kitty cat one hundred and twelve
Posts: 640
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Post by CittyKat112 on Apr 5, 2023 9:48:30 GMT -5
Vanilla Doom sucks, fuck you. Boom/Limit-removing maps are Doom maps, Deep down you know that isn't true. Doom is Doom. Go cope somewhere else I'm telling the truth and your arguments are trash.
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skyr
Doomer
Still looking for the missing chromosomes
Posts: 245
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Post by skyr on Apr 5, 2023 11:04:50 GMT -5
Real G's know that Boom with vanilla limits is the way to go.
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