I recently had a look at the layouts of the actual Doom 2 maps. Many of them are made up of two or three distinct areas, and like 7 or 8 rooms. It's really not much. If I had to recreate these, i think it might take me about a half hour each on today's technology and utilities. I think people overestimate the length a normal Doom map has to be. It doesn't take much to make something that's really fun and memorable.
Yeah, this blows my mind whenever I look at iwads in the editor. Somehow the geniuses at id got so much out of these miniscule layouts. It's really impressive when you compare them to something from e.g. Alien Vendetta. I always found this very inspiring, especially since I'm not good at making big levels. Turns out you don't really need to!
What about MAP08-MAP10, MAP13, MAP15, MAP19, MAP24, MAP27 and MAP29? These are really big, the maps you've showed can be transformed into deathmatch maps without changing too much.
They're pretty small too, aren't they? Comparatively speaking, the maps you've referenced are all much smaller than many user-created maps I've played.
Not that there's anything wrong with maps being bigger. It's just interesting how mappers lean towards bigger and bigger maps. I wonder if mappers make bigger maps because the IWAD maps feel bigger than they actually are? I remembered the IWAD maps being larger but looking at them objectively on the map, I can see that they're actually not very big at all compared to what people often make.
Like I'm new to Doom/Doom2 (finally completed them around 2011) and the maps do feel huge. A megawad like AV is still overwhelming for me and I get lost easily. I even tried DTWID and became annoyed by the very first map, it was so confusing.
Those aren't good examples 40oz , they are all from modern wads expect AV MAP27. Arguably on Final Doom there are the first very big maps: Drake O'Brien levels on TNT, and MAP28 and 29 of Plutonia. Then MM 2 has many big levels, and of course there's Eternal Doom.
Post by valkiriforce on May 28, 2018 11:57:14 GMT -5
I agree that Doom 2's smaller maps really help carry the campaign and make things fast-paced and fun much in the same way it is with The Plutonia Experiment and the first Memento Mori. I think there's a beautiful balance to a map being somewhere between small/medium-sized that feels like the sweet spot of fun for me, but I'll always have a special place in my heart for some of the monstrous affairs found in the community (The Silos and Corporate Hell from MM2, Nemesis and Misri Halek from AV, etc...)
I don't see the surprise here. We've all been trying to build bigger, better and more impressive over the last 24 years, right? As soon as I found a limit, I looked to get around or through it, particularly when I'd seen what other people were doing in the late 90s. Why make 32 forgettable maps when one opus is much better?
Both sides of this debate are very interesting. For those few souls who have actually played my maps, I would imagine my monstrosity Firetop Mountain would stand out in the memory more than my other much shorter maps. On the other hand I don't think any of the Doom 2 maps are unforgettable, are they? Most impressive for me after 40oz pointed it out is how much gameplay is wrung out of Doom 2 layouts. All maps can be great or shit though regardless of size of course.